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WHR General Discussion.

Discussion in 'Narrow Gauge Railways' started by triassic, Jun 4, 2009.

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  1. the-gog

    the-gog Member

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    Big boost for narrow-gauge trains in North Wales

    Hopefully some positive news on this thread:

    http://www.dailypost.co.uk/news/nor...w-gauge-trains-in-north-wales-55578-24568671/

    Big boost for narrow-gauge trains in North Wales

    Aug 31 2009 by Eryl Crump, Daily Post

    Big boost for little trains this summer

    NORTH Wales narrow gauge railway lines are enjoying a bumper summer season with trade soaring by more than half in some cases.

    Many heritage railways across the region expect passenger records to be broken this year as unprecedented numbers of people have ridden on them in the first half of the year.

    Special events, like this weekend's Teddy Bears Picnic at the Llanberis Lake Railway and the Steel, Steam and Stars gala at Llangollen last April, have boosted ticket sales.

    The biggest increase of all was 55% on the Welsh Highland Railway, which now runs between Caernarfon and Hafod y Llyn near Porthmadog.

    At Llanberis the Snowdon Mountain Railway have seen ticket sales rise by 30% as trains are now running through to the summit again.

    The Welsh Highland Railway launched a major marketing campaign in advance of the opening of the section through the Aberglaslyn Pass – voted Britain's favourite landscape in a national poll last year – just before Easter.

    Despite earlier fears, the Welsh Highland has not taken trade away from its sister company, the Ffestiniog Railway, which has reported an 11% upsurge in passenger numbers during the first six months of this year.

    Welsh Highland Railway general manager Paul Lewin said: "The fact that more people are holidaying at home has made a big difference.

    "Passenger numbers are up but they are spending less on refreshments. Takings in the shops are up but by no means as much as ticket sales."

    At Llanberis the Snowdon Mountain Railway officials reported an unprecedented demand for tickets to the summit following the opening of Hafod Eryri visitor centre in June.

    A spokesman said ticket sales were up about 30% on budget with more than 1,000 visitors a day using the 106-year-old rack and pinion track, the only one of its kind in Britain, as it trundles the five miles from Llanberis to the peak.

    Hundreds of people travelled on special steam trains from Liverpool to Holyhead on the Cambrian Coast from Machynlleth to Pwllheli during August.

    On Saturday the Llanberis Lake Railway's Padarn Bear invited his friends to visit the four-mile long line with fun events for children.

    The fun continues today and teddy bears travel free, along with one friend under 10 years old.
     
  2. MartinBall

    MartinBall Guest

    Pity the Daily Post thinks that Llangollen is a narrow-gauge railway!!:rolleyes:
     
  3. the-gog

    the-gog Member

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    It probably lumped the Llangollen in with other heritage lines in the area. Eryl Crump, the journalist, is a well-known steam crank in north Wales.
     
  4. MartinBall

    MartinBall Guest

    Yes - probably some sub-editor cut out a line distinguishing the Llangollen from the others.
     
  5. acorb

    acorb Part of the furniture

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    Had my first ride in a number of years on WHR today, last time I travelled it only ran to Waunfawr! I must admit I have been totally blown away by this amazing line. Yes it was expensive (i can understand why people are only doing sections) and the journey time was long compared to other lines, but when comparing it to something like the 'Cambrian' it is actually very competitive. The ace the line has though is it's scenery and the fabulous engineering as these enormous locomotives pick their way around reverse curves and narrow ledges. The new section is a masterpiece (although I was equally impressed by Waunfawr to Rhyd Ddu). On the return, number 143 struggled for adhesion in the driving rain and what followed was a brilliant battle between power and gravity as the driver encouraged her up the 1-40 reverse curves. It is amazing seeing the locomotive going in the opposite direction as she rounds the sharp bends and then spectacularly losing her feet. Did I mention the rain? Today had the very worst bank hoiliday weather Snowdonia could throw at you but all trains were at least 80% full. On this basis the WHR has a very good future andI look forward to a return visit when the visibility is a bit better!
    On a different note I love the garratts. They may not be authentic but they do somehow suit the rugged terrain and they have a no nonsense and utilitarian look to them. They certainly have plenty of power for the task in hand and represent for me the very essence of the new Welsh Highland which on today's findings has a very bright future.
     
  6. maureen

    maureen Member

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    Im pleased you enjoyed your trip on the WHR Acorb, pity you did'nt have better weather to enjoy the wonderful scenery, yes the Garratts are impressive, because of the nature of the line and the gradients you need powerful engines to cope with the long trains, the K1 not being as powerful as the SA Garratts has to be double headed if handling more than 6 or 7 coaches. the scenery is so wonderful you want to take it leisurely to enjoy it, you don't want to be speeding along, that is what most people go for to see the scenery and take photos, even if you have been on it several times as I have every day throws a different photo opportunity at you, I took photos every day and they are all different. It is very pleasing to read a positive response to a day out on the WHR instead of the rubbish some people who I won't name has written on here.
     
  7. RalphW

    RalphW Nat Pres stalwart Staff Member Administrator Friend

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    Well Maureen if you want more positive, then let me add mine. I made a late booking on the VTL trip earlier this year joining it at Crewe. So I had the pleasure of a trip behind The Earl, cannot remember when I was last behind a GW loco, and was suitably impressed, mind you it did have Bill Andrew in charge..
    Then the run on the WHR, packed train of I think 13 coaches and two Garratts. So the weather was wet and windy but did I care, no it was a great run both ways and well worth it. Yes I will be back soon, waiting for a weekend with a favouirable forecast.
    The Garratts may not be really authentic, but does it matter, they don't look out of place so only a very few nit pickers will want to find fault. The tourists will not know, or care, and they are the ones who the line is catering for.

    You may have seen my video before but for those who have not......


    [youtube]<object width="640" height="385"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/1X5gM4spTQg&hl=en&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/1X5gM4spTQg&hl=en&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="640" height="385"></embed></object>[/youtube]
     
  8. Merlin

    Merlin New Member

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    My prime concern is that on both railways ordinary passengers are being treated as second class citizens in the priority given to coach parties.
    During a recent week in Portmadoc we travelled travelled on the Ffestiniog and were unceremoniousy turfed out of the corridor coaches when we got to Blaenau as they were all booked for coach parties. We were not amused. We observed the same thing happening every day. Noticibly no warning is given when booking that you will have to travel in the vintage coaches. Great for the enthusiast but for families? I overheard one of two other families in our accomodation asking if they had yet tried the Schindlers List experience?
    A close friend went with his family to do the full Welsh Highland journey last week where to be fair he was told in advance that due to booked coach parties the only accomodation would be in an open coach. He declined and the £75 fares for the party of 3 walked away and will not return. It would appear that the railway is only interested in customers from the likes of Shearings. I wonder if they will be there in the winter? Some balance is required or the long term future does not look very good.
     
  9. MartinBall

    MartinBall Guest

    Merlin: were the seats not marked as reserved (as on NR)? If not, that's bad business; if they were, then one should expect that they will be needed at some stage in the trip.

    BTW, it's not been Portmadoc for 35 years! It's Porthmadog.
     
  10. maureen

    maureen Member

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    Thanks for a wonderful video Ralph W,glad you enjoyed your trip on the WHR, no it does'nt matter where the engines are authenitic or not as it is a new raiway there was nothing left of the old WHR, no track, stations, everything has had to built from scratch.
     
  11. maureen

    maureen Member

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    When I travelled on the FR there were large booked parties on all the trains but the coaches were marked as booked, I don't know if this happens all rhe time but that was the situation when I travelled, perhaps a group may of just turned up at short notice without pre booking.
     
  12. Merlin

    Merlin New Member

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    No the coaches were not marked when we travelled. But we called in most days and saw it happen repeatedly with ordinary passengers trying to find somewhere to travel. They were eventually directed to the front of the train to be locked into a vintage coach. The railway was busy but I fear it will not be getting much repeat business.

    I am old enough to remember it as Portmadoc!
     
  13. Christopher125

    Christopher125 Part of the furniture

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    Prioritising coach parties does not mean that the railway is only interested in them, but like any business, it has to prioritise. Neither line can afford to lose coach business because while they could do without it during years like this with huge demand, you need that guaranteed income when times are tough - especially the FR who until this season had seen a worrying downward trend in passenger numbers.

    Im afraid that, apart from finding a magic wand, there is no way to suddenly produce more modern carriages out of thin air; something has to give unfortunately and thats first the use of spare heritage stock, then advising people to come back another day.

    Chris
     
  14. Lez Watson

    Lez Watson New Member

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    ...except when a coach party fails to turn up and the seats are still not available to 'paying' customers. This is not the fault of the railways, of course, as the booked seats are 'owned' for the trip by the coach operating company concerned. It doesn't stop it from being aggravating though.

    L
     
  15. pingadam

    pingadam New Member

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    Admittedley, I have neighbours who went on the Ffestiniog once, and swore they would never return. This was also due to them apparently being unceremoniously ejected from a carriage that, unbeknown to them (at least that's what they claimed), was booked for a coach party.

    Having said that - I agree with Chris that coach parties are important to the FR & WHR business, and the railways need to keep the coach touring companies on board.

    This issue can only be resolved if more carriages are built and locos are in service, so more frequent trains can be run (on the WHR in particular, but also on FR) - and that all costs a very large sum of money (both to build the train sets and to run them and maintain them) that isn't available to the railways at the moment. A bit of a "catch 22" situation.

    Maybe certain fixed days of the week could be set aside for coach parties, so that the printed timetable + website could indicate that spaces for "independent travellers" may not be so easy to find on those days - but then that could put off people visiting on those days, maybe the booked coach party is late or doesn't turn up .... what do you do? It's a difficult balance to get right I guess...

    Bottom line - if the railways maintain this year's level of popularity, then more train sets and more frequent train services will eventually be needed.

    I also agree however that all passengers should be treated with equal respect (whether part of a coach tour, or 'independent' customers) - customer care should be a number one priority.
     
  16. SillyBilly

    SillyBilly Member

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    Perhaps that it is a reminder that if you want seats in a particular place, pre-book them, should you do this a slip is usually placed on the seat when the train arrives at Porthmadog.
     
  17. Baldopeter

    Baldopeter New Member

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    Coach parties


    There is a very large coach business in winter. I have fired a 7 car train in February, the weather was wonderful, and Port seemed as busy as an August day. Last winter 9 and 10 car trains were run.

    I accept independent travelers are very important, we do indeed need more carriages if things continue at this level, it is just a matter of funding them.

    Regards

    Peter
     
  18. Idriverussell

    Idriverussell New Member

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  19. Sheff

    Sheff Resident of Nat Pres

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  20. nanstallon

    nanstallon Part of the furniture

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    coach parties

    Coach parties squeezing individuals out - I found the same kind of thing with youth hostels. The most popular hostels were constantly booked up with school parties, and even if there were some spare beds, the schools insisted that nobody else should be allowed to stay - usual British dirty-minded paranoia. It is a sad fact that Britain is a mass society, and has little room for individuals. I don't want to condemn the Festiniog management - they have to operate commercially, but it's a sad situation.

    John
     
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