insurance

does anyone on here have any information about how they insure themselves for public liability, 3rd party etc? are there any specialist preservation insurers out there. our group has been informed that our landlords insurance will not cover activaties other than those which are being done for our landlords benefit ie tracklaying and other work to do with the site we are based at. Prior to this it was run in a way that by joining our landlord's society you were covered even if you were a seperate group based at the site or by having your own insurance policy. A quote we got last week which did not cover half the work we carried out was a small fortune. if we go back to them with an amended list of the types of work we do the quote will go up by several hundred pounds and probably force us to stop working. we are only a small group with around a dozen working members and the money we make in subs and fundraising will be wiped out with our rent and insurance fees if we have to start forking out anything like the quote we have recieved. does anyone have any advice or know of any reasonable insurers? many thanks in advance.

 

I think it would help if you explained in more detail to us what the nature/structure of your organisation is, and exactly what activities you are undertaking.

 

we were a small voluntary group with a constitution who had a lease on 2 loco's which we are restoring based on a site in the midlands. we have in the last 12 month set ourselves up as a company limited by guarantee to give ourselves a more professional basis to work with and are winding up the group and all memberships will then come through the company as will the intended insurance. we have been informed by our landlord that they will no longer cover OUR'S or any other groups based at the site's working activities, they will only cover the work being done on their infrastructure/rolling stock etc. prior to this being a member of our landlords society covered ANY groups working activities. The activaties we undertake are identical to most of the other restoration groups up and down the country, grinding, drilling, welding, burning, painting, sanding etc etc. our loco is barriered off from the public but they are able to get a reasonable distance towards the loco but things like the above mentioned are not done in a public area though there will be things like fumes and dust but surely this is inevitable. one group on our site has a public walkway right through the middle of their work area so how would this affect their insurance? We take due care and consideration when doing anything that may cause injury to the public or our volunteers though we are able and insist that our volunteers are PPE'd up we cant do that with members of the public/visitors. its the same for all the groups on site as we all work in a shed that while not massively confined you are never very far from public walkways and area's. We need to get insurance for our members, visitors and 3rd party stuff like other groups equipment that could get damaged by our activaties and ideally insurance for our loco. We have a high number of young members which could also affect the insurance quote.

 

If there are other groups in a similar position to you, why not get together & try & obtain an insurance qoute based on all of you? surely that would be cheaper? & as you are all probably doing similar things a consortium might be better. Have you tried your Lanlord's insurers?

 

Your post gives the impression that you are a bit out of your depth in what you are doing. I don't think that you are in the Heritage Railway Association. That might be a good idea. They have people with the specialist knowledge to help you. I also believe that they will be making an announcement about a mutual insurance scheme for heritage railways in the new year, which might well be of use to you.

 

This must be quite a common occurrence in the preservation field. Most preserved lines have loco owning groups "camped out" on their site. I guess it depends on exactly what the business relationship is between the group and their landlord. But what you describe sounds quire draconian as the potential costs would cripple many small groups if this becomes the norm. As Steve says, if you can't do a deal with the Landlord, then best to get some professional (but unbiased) advice. All I'd say is that my Ltd Co is insured for a premium of under £400/year. Ok, I don't do anything 'physical' such as welding, but cocking up a reactor design or precipitating another Bunsfield type explosion would have far great consequences than anything you guys might get up to. So don't go paying squillions. Iain

 

i take umbrage to the comment that we're out of our depth. i dont see how we're out of our depth as we are not doing anything different from what hundreds of other preservation groups around the country do and i would imagine not just in railway preservation, i would think the same happens with buses, lorry aircraft museums etc. even the nrm has an exposed workshop where although it is on 2 floors i bet the insurance company dont neccesarily see it like that with regard to exposure of visitors to risk. having spoken to someone last night it turns out they too are after a quote for their new group based at the same site so we MAY be getting a joint deal. it helps that the leader of this group also runs the health and safety at our site. please feel free to keep any info coming though. if anyone has names and numbers of insurers.

 

Try contacting the Main Line Steam Operators Association. While your group may not be restoring locos for the main line I am sure MLSOA can point you in the right direction to specialist insurers which their members use.

However I think that you are going to have to prepare risk assessments for what you do, show knowledge of and compliance with heath and safety requirements (and this could affect the use of younger volunteers on certain jobs) have a designated project manager and responsible officers nominated to lead the work parties. You will also need Directors indemnity insurance for your Directors and principal officers to cover them against any third party claims which may arise (bear in mind directors of ANY limited Company can be prosecuted and sued as individuals as well as any action that is taken against the body corporate).

Sorry my answer looks so full of paperwork and regulations, but I have been there, done it got the T shirt.

 

This is about right, with the correction that I believe the correct reference ofr you MUST be the Heritage Railway Association, of whicvh I am both Director AND the person responsible for small organisations.!

If you wish to contact me off the forum, my home email is i.b.s@btinternet.com and I'll be delighted to assist. You will certainly need to have such things as Child Protection Policies in place if you have anyone under 18 involved, along side all sorts of Health & Safety legislation.

HRA has Guidance Notes on all these things, and membership gets you access to that advice and much more besides.

Ian Smith

 

There you are, both the definitive answer and an offer of help! Nat Pres working at its best.