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Tornado

Discussion in 'Steam Traction' started by Leander's Shovel, Oct 20, 2007.

  1. RalphW

    RalphW Nat Pres stalwart Staff Member Administrator Friend

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    It's the only option, where else would the boiler go for repair? it was built at Meiningen, so that's where to get it fixed.
     
  2. S.A.C. Martin

    S.A.C. Martin Part of the furniture

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    Why does it?

    A hell of a lot of people put a hell of a lot of work into making this locomotive work, and build it in the first place. What about all the covenators, engineers, designers and fundraisers? Is that their hubris too?

    Overall I feel the gloating - and to some extent, it reads like that - to be wholly unjustified, and thoroughly unpleasant.

    I find it thoroughly disgusting that anyone could look at these problems and think them justified. For what exactly? A few comments some unnamed person is reputed to have said, that somehow covers the whole of the A1 Trust, its members, covenators and volunteers?

    For shame.
     
  3. railway

    railway New Member

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  4. Sheff

    Sheff Resident of Nat Pres

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  5. Duty Druid

    Duty Druid Resident of Nat Pres

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    Definite case of 'return to mender' - they made it they fix it - no arguement simples!
     
  6. jane

    jane Guest

    I for one would like to wish tornado people all the best with there loco and hope to see her back on main line sooner rather than later;
    to many folk's on here love to see other down fall's if you were true steam fan you would not wish anyone bad luck a lot of hard work goe's into keeping all the main line loco up and running and i can tell you it not easy it very early morning's and very late night's we dont get payed for doing it we do it as we love keeping steam out on main line ;
    all the best
    jane;
    long live steam on main line;
     
  7. Steve from GWR

    Steve from GWR Well-Known Member

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    I quite agree Jane, well said
     
  8. stan the man

    stan the man Member

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    Ditto.

    Well said Jane.

    Stan
     
  9. It's very clear that Tornado is very much a 'pet love' of yours, Simon, both from your postings on here and the RMweb forum. However, on this forum a whole range of different loco owners get 'bashed' (and I don't mean in a diesel spotter way) by forum users and I don't see you leaping to the defence of all of them in the same aggressive way.

    I have no feelings one way or the other for Tornado, but from such an 'independent' standpoint (if you will) I can see that there are people who the A1 Trust has clearly rubbed up the wrong way, for whatever reasons. Can't you just accept that nobody is completely perfect (no, not even your beloved A1 Trust) and that those criticising them may have valid reasons (in their eyes, at least) for doing so? Free speech and all that? Isn't that what forums are for?

    You seem to take every single opinion that isn't fawning praise for Tornado and its creators as a personal insult. From here, it all sounds a bit scarily evangelical, 'tear in the eye' and all. :pray2: Chill, mate - it's a repairable chunk of flipping metal, not a dying child!

    It's also noticeable that your posting style is much more acquiescent on RMweb than on here sometimes - largely, I suspect, because you know the overtly heavy-handed moderation there would have you chucked off in short order for posting in the tone you use here sometimes. Isn't it just a teeny bit disrespectful towards NatPres's mods that RMweb gets 'nice quiet' Simon but NatPres gets 'sometimes really rather shouty' Simon?
     
  10. charlie harry

    charlie harry New Member

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    some people on this planet might think justified, but just remember how much support the A1 trust has had and how popular the locomotive is, i think this tells you what most people think, wish the A1 trust all the best in getting tornado running again.

    Charlie.
     
  11. Spamcan81

    Spamcan81 Nat Pres stalwart

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    Well said Jane. Anyone who wishes any locomotive ill or rejoices in its problems is a fool and a disgrace to the preservation movement.
     
  12. S.A.C. Martin

    S.A.C. Martin Part of the furniture

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    Perhaps because I haven't seen them? I can't read every single thread, you know... ;)

    However I have on occasion when I've seen it raised the question as to why a comment has to be made against any locomotive organization - we don't know the ins and outs, after all, most of the time.

    Absolutely, but there's a clearly a line between "rubbing up the wrong way" and "wishing ill health" which my grandmother has always taught me to never do.

    Accepted, sometimes the flame burns a little hotter than it should do...

    You'll forgive me I hope, but Tornado itself represents a personal side of my life, sadly passed away some time ago. I remember the stories as a child of the steam engines "in the old days" and remember how much my grandfather longed to see the project come to fruition. He didn't, sadly, he died in 2001 and it pains me to think about what he's missed and I get to see so often.

    Not so, by any means, and I find that quite insulting and derisory. I have on several times been the "shouty Simon" (read the Hornby 2011 thread! ;) ), but I don't think I've been out of line in my posting on either site in any event. Not flaming/trolling/insulting or otherwise.

    Simply answering the case and asking the questions when it arises.

    Now - my question to you - do you feel the above comment I addressed to be wholly justified, whatever experiences that poster had of the A1 Trust? For my own part, I've had dealings with groups which have not be entirely pleasant, but I would never wish ill on them or their locomotive in any way.

    Perhaps that's where I differ.
     
  13. Neil_Scott

    Neil_Scott Part of the furniture

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    Sometimes I think it's best to steer clear of the things closest to our hearts on forums like these. You only end up getting frustrated and saying things out of character (and giving the wrong impression of yourself) or making statements that you might regret.
     
  14. S.A.C. Martin

    S.A.C. Martin Part of the furniture

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    Quite. However reading back through my own comments, I do not regret questioning that I find unpalatable.

    I'm clearly in the minority it seems, so I'll retire to my shell and draw my neck in.
     
  15. 61624

    61624 Part of the furniture

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    I think you are being oversensitive. I think Tornado is the best thing to have happened to the steam movement in recent times, but I think it is also becoming clear that the untried design of all welded boiler was perhaps not the best option to have taken. I doubt we'd be seeing the current problems with a boiler and copper firebox to the original design, and you have to wonder if the initial cost saving was enough to offset the loss of revenue from the current and previous round of repairs.

    Whilst it is true that hinsight is a wonderful thing, I think at the time the original decision was reached there were quite a lot of misgivings expressed. I don't think fingers should be pointed or that people should crow at being proved right, but the lessons that have emerged need to be taken on board. It will be interesting to see if the A1SLT's second boiler follows the same design!
     
  16. Duty Druid

    Duty Druid Resident of Nat Pres

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    Whilst I agree that Tornado is the best thing since sliced bread to have happened to the steam movement in general, maybe - just maybe when she was being built and they engineered out known design flaws, they may have also engineered in unknown problems by over engineering, ie the precision cut frames to name but one & this just might be a contributing factor as to what has happened.

    I just hope (fingers crossed) that she is back where she belongs in the not to distant future.
     
  17. std tank

    std tank Part of the furniture

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    Surely, the frames were cut in a similar way as those cut in LNER and BR days, but using newer technology. They would have been machined as per the drawing.
     
  18. osprey

    osprey Resident of Nat Pres

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    Absolutely, they would have cut the frames using CAD/CAM which would have produced a more faster/cleaner/accurate shape. All the running clearances etc would have to be as per original I would have thought
     
  19. ADB968008

    ADB968008 Guest

    This topic has been referred to the moderators for discussion, for now it will be left open.

    Whilst people can say what they wish, they have to stand by their words, and you can be tracked down.

    I therefore reccomend that some posts above, that the original poster may want to reconsider their words and maybe use the edit button (or ask the moderators if they wish to retract or remove it, unless they truly want to stand by their beliefs and defend it with proof ?)

    My personal advice... press the pm button, say it was in error and ask the mods to remove it.
     
  20. twr12

    twr12 Well-Known Member

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    AAAAAARRRRRRRGGGGGHHHHHHHH! All steel welded boilers have worked well in this country andthroughout the rest of the world!
     

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