Possibly class O4 repatriation idea.

Very true, but I imagine that if a GWR 30xx was what was wanted it would be the Swindonised version.

 

Makes you want to vomit! as id there isn't enough damn GWR locos already!

 

It not possible to have too many GW locos but that does'nt justify modding an 04 to make it a pseudo GW one!

 

Why modify a (rare) loco to make it look like something different? In fact why remove it from its home? They were built in Britain fair enough but they've worked in Australia for all of their life, in my view that makes them more Australian than British. But while we're at making 'new' locos out of others, lets get a Bulleid pacific and make it look like the Great Bear, they're both 4-6-2s and it would be a GWR 'new build' project!

 

That is a joke isn't it. Because you might as well melt it down as the metal is the only usefully part

 

The Bulleid to Great Bear bit was obviously a joke! Or I thought it was obvious.

 

Sorry i just woke up from a nap. Thats my excuse anyway.

 

That is a very good point and one I almost agree with. I would however like to see one of them return IF its to be restored to working order simply because either of the Dorrigo ones is unlikely ever to get more than a cosmetic restoration, and even that seems slim....

 

Hmmm some extreme missing of the point seems to have happened somewhere.

I think what williamfj2 was trying to say is that painting an Australian 04 green and putting some brass bits on doesn't make it an GWR 30xx. It just makes it an Australian 04 with green and brass bits.

This might come as a bit of a shock to some but the history of railways does exist outside The Big Four, BR and the UK folks. Other peoples heritage is equally as important as our own and there is nothing to be gained by destroying that all sake of a new photo opportunity.

The fact that British locos were exported all over the world should be celebrated not disguised.

Tim

 

Exactly - excellent point.

It seems to be a little unnoticed but isn't a Dubs 4-8-2T coming back home from South Africa?

 

Due to the terrible things that are happening to "preserved" locos in SA, that can only be a good thing. Is it the NBL society that are repatriating it?

 

Yes I think it is - let me have a dig around and see if I can find the thread...

 

Here it is, over in the International section of course:

http://railways.national-preservation.com/showthread.php/15729-South-Africa-Loco-Sales/page2

 

I don't think anyone has mentioned that there was a proposal to repatriate one of the ROD 2-8-0s when the last ones were withdrawn in the early 70s - I still have the copy of "Trains and Railways" containing a picture of the 2-8-0, Mersey tank and I think Kitson ST lined up. Fell through because of shipping costs I believe.

Personally I think it would be an excellent idea to bring one home but talk of rebuilding into something it never was probably doesn't help the cause; Australia is rightly sensitive about exporting its heritage and I imagine a plan to restore it in ROD / J A Brown condition would have more chance of winning an export licence. The WDLR 4-6-0T probably illustrates this point - purchase for recreation into one of the Snailbeach locos (am I allowed to say that?) would possibly not have succeeded where commemoration of the wartime role did.

Peter Hayward

 

Did J & A Brown modify these 3 surviving Robinson Great Central 8Ks to any degree from ROD condition ? There seems to be very little on the web about them.

They are:
JABAS no 20 (ex ROD 1984, built by North British)
JABAS no 23 (ex ROD 2004, built by Great Central ?)
JABAS no 24 (ex ROD 2003, built by Great Central ?)

David

 

They appear to be in exceptionally original condition, quite different in appearance to 63601. The only thing that doesn't look original on them, from what I can see from the one photo I've seen, is the buffers.

 

I only briefly flicked through whichever mag this was in, but wasn't it one of the April editions? Everyone was going on about 60019 becoming 4464 being the April Fool Spoof. Could this be it instead?

 

Don't count your chickens before they're hatched...

The two RODs known as RVR 20 & 24 are very unlikely to be repatriated to the UK. There are two other organisations in Australia that have long term claims on them.

1) The NSWRTM have wanted one since 1963, being outbid by scrap metal merchants in 1973 when the RVR sold them. The NSWRTM have recognised that these locomotives are very significant to NSW because they represent the second largest (in terms of numbers) private railway locomotive class in NSW, 13 were purchased by John & Alexander brown Abermain Seaham Collieries Limited for service on the Richmond Vale Railway. The NSWRTM also recognises their value to Australia due to their service in the ROD, where Australians made up a significant proportion of that organisation's strength.

2) The Australian War Memorial has an interest too, due to the ROD connection. The AWM does have a Hunslet 4-6-0T restored and on display, but a plan that AWM has is to rebuild the Amiens Railway Gun http://cas.awm.gov.au/item/A05269 and display it with a ROD if it were available.

Just to be a spoilsport, I would write a somewhat lengthy submission to the Federal Government opposing such an export based upon their significance to the development of Australia's economy circa 1920-1973 and their local significance to NSW. Remember, these three (including No 23 masquerading as No 21) have approximately zero significance to the UK. They were built there: ROD 20 - North British 22042 of 1918, ROD 23 Gorton ??? of 1918 and ROD 24 - Gorton ???? of 1918. They were in the Queensferry dump from 1920 until export to Australia. They saw service in Australia from circa 1923 to 1968 (20) & 1973 (23 & 24). One of them, I think, saw some service in the UK circa 1920 for a few months. None of the trio are in any danger of being scrapped and none of them will be allowed to deteriorate beyond 'saving point.'

Any restoration of these locomotives, or indeed overhaul of them, should be completed to the requirements of a carefully prepared conservation management plan (CMP). Remember, these are not toys, like a lot of locomotives in tourist service today are. Each one should be presented in a form displaying its most significant period of its life. AFAIK, there are two periods of significance for these locomotives, portraying their ROD service of 1918 to 1920 or portraying their RVR service from circa 1922 to 1973. To present them in any other form or any other livery is to treat them as toys which they are not.

These locomotives are indeed in very 'original' condition. They are still fitted with piston tailrods as someone else pointed out. The main modification to them was to remove their Westinghouse Air Compressors from the smokebox sides. I think that one of the three still has the brackets on the smokebox.

If you really must have another one of these in the UK, why don't you go for the one in Libya that was shown in a photograph in Steam Railway circa 1982?

Just to open a can of worms here, I call every 'heritage railway' operating planet wide 'Tourist Railways' because that is what they really are.

 

You never know!
I've been reading up about three types of "Empire" locos using in the middle east, and possibaly still existing. They are an 0-6-0, 4-6-0 and 2-8-0. Robinson was on the comittee for designing these and the 0-6-0 bears very strong resemblance to a GCR 9J, not sure about the 4-6-0, and the 2-8-0 looks like a GCR 8M to me with walschaerts valve gear. From correspondence with several people in the know it appears that at least 1 of the 0-6-0 still exists and is in working order. If a scheme to repatriate on of those to make a pom pom happens, my hand will be swiftly popping in my pockets to find a few coppers!

 

Spinner... NAIL + HEAD

Whilst these locos were built here they are not really "our" history, they are Australia's. The closest example of this that I could think of would be if a US museum came over here and bought up a load of US built Warplanes (Phantoms, WW2 kit etc) that had served its entire working life in the RAF (bar a couple of months stored somewhere in a USAAF airbase) and then hacked them about into replicas of US aircraft that they have already got preserved.

The 8Fs were a good save as they were in a dangerous situation, along with the Dubs loco recused by the NBLoco group. Let us not forget we have enough on our plate for the mean time, many of the barry wrecks are still, barry wrecks, we are building new locos to fill holes in demand/help create a sustaiinable steaming future. The last thing we need is a loco from down under that was safe as it was, if anything needs saving it is the Greek Austerity 2-10-0s..

This is not some personal attack on people who want to see these locos here, I would love another GCR ROD but I also think it is unbelievably important to realise what effect it could have on another societies history.

m0rris