L&B and the ENPA

I wish sometimes there was a little more optimisum with regard to the Lynton and Barnstaple

 

"How long is the string"

We are probably talking about 5 years to get the TWO Act. 2 years at an absolute minimum with all the rigt people and skills and the money needed, and then only if funds permit. It has to be quantified before starting a campaign to fund it. How much and by when out in the open public domain, not concealed on some private members only web site.

The Narrow gauge world wants to know what is part 1 of the plan, what is in part 1 and how cheap can it be done.!!!

I have talked to the person driving the TWO back last year.( He is good he is the best !! and he is enthusiastic) and he has explained to me in detail, what is involved in acheiving the TWO, its a tall order not made easier by the conflicts within the organisation.

"The people " who want an L&B want to see it happening, you cannot run trains under the road ( well you might be able to actually, there are other ways than the TWO) , without the TWO, it is more involved but that does not stop you building the bridge one does not have to come before the other and the bridge detail is interactive with Highways , the design is done and as far as I know approved.

Members want to contribute toward a bridge, some thing they can see.some progress some real thing.

By the time the bridge is built we may be near to acheiving TWO status.

Members will not support an open pit to chuck money in to get a TWO, but as a joint " Bridge and TWO fund" yes there might be apeal to some members.

Many realise both objectives have to be acheived in the medium term and to expand and run a self governing railway operation.

 

You can lead a horse to water ..........

 

An Update

The TWA Order specialist has now been elected as a Trustee ( Bruce ). He gave an apraisal of his views at Saturday evening's AGM about what is required to move forward, its a big bite all the way to Blackmoor Gate and nothing shorter in his opinion.

The future growth or continuation of the L&B would appear, from this talk and what other Directors and Trustees on the platform said during the meeting, it all hindges on raising enough funds to firstly acheive this task ( the TWA) of about £ 1.5 million pounds.

The meeting was and came across as very up beat and enthusiastic , with the "Railway" being in good hands and performing well so far.

However the books up to Dec 2010 indicate that year on year the trading losses of the operating company have increased, being offset by people within its management giving or loaning large sums of money, to balance these losses.This was questioned as to how this situation was going to be corrected in the future as were other aspects of the operation by people from the floor.

It is hoped that the latest appeal sent out with the last magazine a week ago will generate sufficient funds to start the TWA O process. Bruce spoke to me after the meeting and confirmed he had had several important discussions with ENP officals recently and other bodies that would affect the planned expansion, well Done Bruce if you can do it..

My efforts will be concentrated with EA and its shareholders working on more aquistions of trackbed, south of Blackmoor Gate.


The relationship at present is -: EA will go on doing what it does best and EA does not obstruct and never has obstructed , what the L&B Trust , CIC and the objectives of EE are, to expand the current operation in the North of the L&B. It is unlikely there will be a closer working relationship than that why does it need one??.

The current L&B management has no projected use for the land that EA is presently purchasing in the YEO Valley or anywhere South of Whistlandpound Resovior as they intend to terminate their planned operation North of the A39 at Blackmoor Gate.

When the Exmoor Enterprise have a need for the next section to expand south from Killington Lane, that was Farmer Rawles land,(currently held by EA) they will need to come and negotiate for either its purchase from EA or a Lease for its use absolutely no problem there.

We feel sure that ENP or the TWAO will not have a problem with this arrangement, we are supportive and in favour of a Railway and its expansion, that is why EA continues to buy land and track bed.

I will let all you readers work out what the plan might be.!!

Thanks TheEngineer

 

Good news indeed!

 

It would seem sensible to me that the L&B purchased that land from EA for an appropriate sum, the proceeds of which would be for EA to put towards their next aquisition. I assume that purchase is included in the £1.5 million budget required to extend?

As I understand it, the L&B require ~£25k to fund the application for the TWAO - hopefully not too difficult to achieve in a fairly short amount of time. Then on to the £1.5 million - that's a lot of coffee mornings, but hopefully there will be some large donations, corporate sponsorship and council grants that will move things along nicely.

 

That's the trouble, Chris, too much optimism! If you, or anyone else really wants to see a useful, working, sustainable Lynton & Barnstaple, they need to suspend blind optimism and start addressing the realities.

A working Lynton & Barnstaple, run on possibly the WH model, running from a large, free car park at Blackmoor Gate through to the twin towns with some sort of Cromford-style cable car link would benefit Exmoor by;
* Taking a large amount of road traffic off the parallel A39
* Enhancing the town environment, and thus boosting the tourism potential of Lynton/Lynmouth
* Boosting the potential tourism in its own right
* Providing enhanced employment opportunities for local people, both directly and indirectly

There are probably many others. For the enthusiast it offers;

* Half-hourly trains - Barnstaple-Lynton and you would be lucky to get 4 trains a day, as per WH.
* Profitability - sufficient to subsidise construction and operation of replica train, stations etc.
* Sustainability - keep costs reasonable, and you can tap into the link road - Ilfracombe/Woolacombe traffic ad infinitum.

But that's Blackmoor Gate-Lynton. Anything else would just be a pleasant train ride, a minor tourist attraction. Not really of great interest to ENPA...

 

Why is sustainability so important? Very few heritage railways are sustainable, they are a bit like football clubs that rely on a wealthy benefactor to prop them up. Many railways need the members money to rebuild stations, overhaul engines, replace track, fund bridge replacement. I doubt the L&B would be any different. What is important is that the operating company covers it losses.

 

Also to be borne in mind is that the ENPA are the planning authority north of the A39 at Blackmoor Gate - to the South it is the responsibility of North Devon District Council. Although I'm sure the two planning teams do work closely together, there will be different requirements and different priorities in the two sections, which could lead to an entirely different character in any restored southern section.

 

Like Portsmouth Football Club? Covering your losses may be OK in the good times, but what happens in the bad? When your local council or wealthy individuals can no longer spare those hidden subsidies? Like in today's economic climate?

The first duty of an organisation whether it be a country, a company, or a railway club, is to survive. If it isn't going to survive, why start it in the first place?! Starting something on a woolly premise and a strategy of 'winging it' will ultimately result in failure. Success requires a sound premise, that provides a sustainable strategy, and a directorate fully able to plan, maintain and develop that.

Too many appear to see heritage railway operation as a larger version of their train set. Unlike train sets, real railways rot, wear out, are hideously expensive to run and require complex inter-personal skills to manage successfully, which is why too many heritage railways stumble early on in their development. Success goes to those with the clearest ideas and the man-management skills to enact them. A good plan, firm and progressive direction and adherence to the goal, in their turn encourage investment, without which it would fail anyway. All this amounts to credibility.

Sustainability is about moving forwards in the confidence that you can weather unknown shocks due to your concern's financial and trading solidity, born out of profitability, lack of reliance on exterior funding (and this includes your members) for day to day operations, and a sound, business plan.

If you don't like this, you can always pull out the Hornby-Dublo!

 

Well said EP, this does not just apply to this project, its any project attracting people to join in.

If the base business can stand up as a commercial operation albeit limited in what it does,that means it is in good shape, to deliver the service, for which it was designed it will then attract people, all sorts of people who see it as sustainable and with fiundation and objective.

If its not sustainable in the longer term, it needs re adjusting so that it is.

People generally, at least "credible people" like to be associated with usefull use of their resources and time, toward a sucessfull group project.

At that stage they might invest in it.

Any other support such as , funding , materials and people are the icing on the cake.

That make it good and make it grow.

Alienating people to acheive a plan ( however good or realistic that plan might seem to be) does not help.

 

Something you could do well to remember!

 

Your statement would be realistic but I am not in control of the plan !! something you forgot !!

I finished being involved and having input to the plan back in Febuary 2008 as aresult of being alienated by those with the "NEW" plan.

The"OLD" plan I had and was working on previous to that actually generated money , into the operation.

Could you understand that ?Its a necessity of a business to have enough to invest generated from what it does.

As for alienating people , yes Iam sure I have but that could be for many different reasons, if its for speaking out and putting up facts and views , and that has resulted in me alienating certain people, its a shame they cannot accept the picture is different to how they view it.

My take on this criticism is , some of them must have a rosey view of reality, I do not, they come along and enjoy what those with reality created, comment on it but contribute nothing productive to improve it .

If these people who are alienated by me or my actions are in that bracket , they are no loss to me or the project.

We have to have a team of realists to run this or any other project, who first of all understand the obstacles and how to solve them, can debate and form sound plans, with a project cost that is attainable.

I have alienated a few they have alienated masses.But yes I accept I have alienated a few People including you Orion. Sorry Reality calls.

 

Remind me how many heritage railways have closed in the recent recession?

 

ummm...I think the Wensleydale Railway sums up my premise perfectly. Was championed as a Community Railway, but this premise was soon proven to be faulty. It wasn't sustainable. It is now reinventing itself as a conventional heritage railway, and I hope it succeeds at this.

As for the above quote, well, we're hardly into the recession yet, are we? Once the supply of retirees on generous index-linked pensions start to fall away, and less people have money to spare, days out to, and support for heritage railways will dramatically decrease. Then you will have concerns drastically scaling back their activities or even ceasing operation.

If you believe your statement, that heritage railways have been dependant upon outside support to remain viable in a boom, how do you think they're going to perform in a chronic and debilitating recession?!!

 

I don't think that even happened in this recession - hardly backing up your argument. One railway failing out of the whole movement isn't much to justify an argument either.

If the L&B thinks that it can achieve all it wants without relying on funding from its members in the future, that it will become 'sustainable' and never have to go round asking for funds to overhaul an engine, build a new coach, buy a patch of land etc etc then good luck. I doubt it will though. The members and funding bodies will always be there to offer income to do these things.

 

It backs up my argument perfectly. As a Community Railway it wasn't sustainable. It doesn't matter whether that happened in the boom or bust, indeed if it can't sustain itself in a boom it would have been doubly unsustainable!

During the boom years of railway preservation over the last fifteen years, too much reliance was placed upon seemingly limitless reserves of finance and manpower. Both are now in shorter supply, and it's only going to get worse. To build a railway that requires an annual subsidy from whatever source is playing Russian Roulette with Fate. At worst case, estimated income needs to cover estimated costs. Otherwise it's like saying that house prices will never go down - remember how that played out 1990-6?? If you require
running costs to be topped up by passing the hat round or a grant, then one day you're going to be unlucky, the money won't be there, and then what do you do?

I would consider contributions by members like rendering on a wall - makes it a whole lot prettier, but you wouldn't build a wall out of it. grants are great towards a one-off capital cost, like an extension, but you wouldn't use one to subsidise the operation of that extension.... Call on your members in an emergency, not as a matter of course....otherwise the well may run dry just when you need the water most.

As a matter of interest, do most heritage railways rely upon members contributions to balance the operational books?? Perhaps there are other readers out there who can nay or yea this..... If true, it is very worrying indeed.....

 

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As a matter of interest, do most heritage railways rely upon members contributions to balance the operational books?? Perhaps there are other readers out there who can nay or yea this..... If true, it is very worrying indeed.....

Some do, some don't. Depends on circumstances. There have been times when the supporting body has donated sums to balance the books, even on long established lines.