More activity at Rother Valley Railway

There is a comparable level crossing on the Wallingford Bypass for the C&WR, plus the extended crossing of the A487 in Porthmadog on the Welsh Highland, and in the future, there will be a level crossing over the very busy A5 for the Cambrian Heritage Railway, so there is precedent around the country for Heritage Railways to cross pretty major roads on the level, providing suitable protection is in place.

 

Not on the Welsh Highland, they weren't, though granted there was the prospect of the bypass being built at the time they were laid. Saying that, it (the bypass, not the WHR) still hasn't opened, and the traffic queues have been no worse than those caused by the traffic lights on the High Street.

What is the speed limit on the relevant stretch of the A21? Given the proximity of the roundabout to the potential crossing, I'd have thought that the actual speed of traffic would be quite low, though I suspect that it could be a mixed blessing, as I can't see the Highways Authority being particularly happy with the prospect of southbound traffic queueing onto the roundabout.

I also notice from OS maps that the A21 is on an embankment at this point, presumably above the floodplain of the Rother. Given that the equivalent railway embankment between the old A21 at Northbridge Street and the current Robertsbridge bypass (and beyond up to Salehurst) either never existed or has been removed (again, according to 1:25,000 OS maps - I have no knowledge of the situation on the ground) then the possibility of a bridge being struck through said embankment surely exists - depending of course upon the relative heights of trackbed and road.

 

There's another update on the RVR site, and i've just found this interesting blog with information on what they're doing.

Chris

 

I think a bridge under the A21 would be an excellent idea, providing the intention was to run 00 gauge trains, and all passengers were taught to limbo! In practice, the height difference is negligible in real terms. There have been whispers about the A21 being raised on stilts at some point in the future to get it properly out of the flood risk. Any suggestion of going under the A21 at present would have to cope with the very real risk of all passengers having to be issued with snorkels prior to departure. The speed limit on that section is, I believe, 60mph, but the council has been looking for an excuse to put a lower limit on for some time..... At that point, a level crossing becomes useful in more ways than one.

 

The people who are doing the planning of the extension i believe had a role in the Welsh Highland rebuilding ,So i would guess they might just know what they are doing far more than us chairbound planners but what bothers me is this, given that the KESR only have a set ammount of suitable rolling stock and locos, will we be able to cope with an additional 3 miles and the presure that an connection with The main line will bring, ie connecting with on going trains because at the moment if you run late, it doesnt really create an problems, but get people missing their train connections etc,it soon adds up to very bad publicity

 

I really dont think thats an issue, many lines link with the national network without any such problems and i dont see why the KESR would be any different. Besides, with 2tph off-peak they wouldnt be delayed by much.

Chris

 

The issue of connecting with NR won't be a problem but the provision of locos and rolling stock certainly will be. Although not a huge distance, it will be a quantum leap in resource requirements.

 

The kesr does have enough locos and stock to run to robertsbridge, although possibly not enough in running order or even suitable. But that depends on the train service/s that will eventuality be operated. it may for example work out that the normal service is not much different from today. A two train service. Which would on a day to day operating viewpoint will not be a large jump in resources. ie same number of guards, loco crew and signalmen.

 

Has it been confirmed that there will be no signalbox at Robertsbridge?

Chris

 

see latest update http://www.rvr.org.uk/html/updates.html

 

Isn't that rather fundamental? Don't get me wrong, I'm all in favour of extending to Robertsbridge but I'm realistic enough to know that laying the track is only the tip of the iceberg. The extra length is going to add a minimum of 30 minutes on to each return trip, quite probably a bit more. If you simply keep a two train service then your day is going to have to start earlier and finish later, with longer gaps between trains. This simplistic view ignores where passing loops are and these may no longer be in suitable places to simply extend journey times; it might be necessary to increase terminal times, as well. It also ignores the fact that Joe Public wants to travel when it wants to and not when you say it has to. 10.00 may be too early a start and 18.00 too late a finish. Then there's the situation that running to/from Robertsbridge will hopefully encourage people to start their journey from there. That may require an earlier start/later finish from Robertsbridge than starting/finishing all trains from Tenterden will allow. The longer journey will also require more water and possibly a top-up of coal during the day, not convenient when Rolvenden is the main servicing point. Having extended days may be impractical in terms of staff hours (I know that it is a big problem on the NYMR) and you may have to double up on some staff duties. Not everyone is willing to work an 11-12 hour shift as a volunteer.
No doubt this has all been considered by those that need to but resourcing the service is not as simple as you make out. If it hasn't been considered then it needs to be on someone's agenda.

 

Timetable options are flying round the operating office like confetti. The Loco and C&W departments are looking at all options. An ex GWR Barry Wreck is newly arrived at Rolvenden. A C&W shed is to be built at Rolvenden to reduce carriage maintenance. Long term plans are in hand for a loco shed. There is consideration of a new passing loop being laid somewhere. The present main line is slowly being upgraded to reduce maintenance. All possiblities are being considered.

I'm going on 67 and hope that I'll be fit enought to drive a train to Robertsbridge, on the present showing I should manage it at about 74!

 

Howard,problem is that even the youngest Mk1 is over 50 years old and we find more and more needs attension with each exam , as someone said, laying the track is the easy bit but at the moment we struggle to keep even the A set fit for traffic at times, add on to this that the future need will be for 2Mk1 rakes in use , i just hope that what plan gets dreampt up is done with a long term plan in mind, trying to overhaul Pedros and an NBO at the same time as carrying out 18 monthly and emergency repairs does not work , the new carrage and wagon shop looks more like a deisel depot rather than a carrage overhaul shop

 

Personally, I think we should give up on mk1's and restore more of the chicken sheds instead. Oh, hang on....

 

As far as the civil engineering is concerned there's nothing insurmountable and a lot of detailed planning has taken place. I'm not sure what I can actually make public yet so best I don't say too much but rest assured all the issues raised have been discussed in a lot of detail. With locos and coaching stock we have already built an extension to the C&W workshops at Tenterden and have plans to start on a carriage storage shed and loco depot extension as part of vital works to enable the Robertsbridge project. a lot has been done on projected timetables, which actually is vital information for deciding how many locos/coaches etc and various infrastructure requirements i.e. level crosssings/water columns/track layouts/passing places etc.

One of the biggest challenges is the increase in volunteers required. We estimate that we will need to increase footplate staff by approx 1/3 for example. Training new volunteers to be Drivers to go to Robertsbridge is something that we are already working hard to achieve. Today's new volunteer could be one of the first drivers into Robertsbridge, now is the time to join up if that idea appeals to you!!!

 

Hi Pete,

I didn't think that the resourcing issue would have gone by without forethought and it is obvious from what you've said that there is a lot to do to bring it all together. You've a good team down there and I'm sure that you'll succeed.

 

Although there is far more to opening an extension than laying the track, it is still a very visible statement of intent.

With the Junction Road weekend in March and the forthcoming bridge rebuilding programme at Robertsbridge, it is exciting to see that the project is really moving forward. Linking Robertsbridge and Bodiam, with the complex issue of the A21 crossing, is going to be one of preservation's epic challenges, but the willpower is very clearly there. I recall reading an article by the General Manager saying that the big concern is that reaching Robertsbridge may boost overall passenger numbers but could turn the Bodiam-Tenterden section into a rather long siding, with not too many people wanting to make the full journey. This would be a shame. The K&ESR has some delightful scenery and a charming rural branch line atmosphere. Tenterden town is well worth a visit too, and, of course, the climb up from Rolvenden will still remain the most exciting stretch of line from the performance angle.

Another issue, which I seem to remember from a much earlier thread on this forum is the limitations of the "Austerity" tanks which have played such a major role on tbe K&ESR so far. A footplate volunteer from one line (I think it was the Strathspey) which uses Austerities said that they are not really very suitable engines for a line above 10 miles in length. The purchase of 4253, even if it is going to need a lot of work before it can steam again, is an obvious step towards building a fleet of engines able to cope with a 28-mile round trip. One can think of several other locos which are suitable, complete and up for sale, but obviously they cost a lot of money.

It's all too easy for armchair observers like me to reiterate these problems, but I have no doubt that they will be overcome and will be following developments with great interest. I read recently of someone suggesting that one day it could be possible to make a one-way journey involving travel on 3 heritage lines - from Sheffield Park to Tenterden via East Grinstead, Hurst Green, Eridge, Tunbridge Wells West, Tunbrdge Wells Central and Robertsbridge. It would make a great day - assuming that the Kingscote-East Grinstead and Bodiam-Robertsbridge links are complete before this government concretes over the entire South East of England.

 

Tunbridge Wells West to Tunbridge Wells Central? I hadn't heard about that one - apart from when I visited the Lewes to Uckfield reopening pages Is there something I should know?