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7027 Thornbury Castle

Discussion in 'Steam Traction' started by svrhunt, Jan 18, 2015.

  1. 2392

    2392 Well-Known Member

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    I seem to recall that both Thornbury Castle and Earl of Bathurst were acquire back in the late sixties/early seventies, by the BirminghamRaailway Museum/owners of Clun Castle as a source of spares, for their loco.....As both machines came away from Barry pretty well complete with all their major parts.
     
  2. GWR4707

    GWR4707 Nat Pres stalwart

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    It was Earl of Mount Edgecombe and Thornbury (and Defiant) and in the early 70's. Castles leaving Barry (number to leave Barry and date)

    5051 (4) February 1970
    7027 (23) August 1972
    5043 (43) August 1973
    5080 (62) August 1974
    5029 (81) May 1976

    This would suggest that in August 1972 7027 was considered the best condition one, and what was it with Tyseley taking them out of the yard in August each year!
     
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  3. mdewell

    mdewell Well-Known Member Friend

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    Well it does seem that 90% of their content is cut'n'paste' from other people press releases, so I don't take much notice of whatever they publish anyway.
     
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  4. alexl102

    alexl102 Member

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    From what I've seen 2999 doesn't really attract that much intertest full stop. Aside from being a new-build, there's nothing really interesting about it. Especially as it spends 99% of its life pootling up and down a small demonstration line with 2 coaches.

    With all these GW new builds I can see them each doing a ticket and hten being placed on static display whilst some sub-society of the GWS persue funding to build another niche Swindon loco that'll do only one ticket before the cycle repeats
     
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  5. RAB3L

    RAB3L New Member

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    What exactly is the point of another Star, unless the purpose is to run it on the mainline? Will it be a Star with Castle cylinders (and outside Castle steam pipes)? Should it have internal steam pipes - the only real alternative is the original outside steam pipes which were prone to cracking. Otherwise it would need new cylinders or be another Frankenstein monster like 4709. Was the "plan" to build the Star just a means to placate the objectors?
     
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  6. mdewell

    mdewell Well-Known Member Friend

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    Not counting all the time (4 months?) it recently spent at Severn Valley then?
     
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  7. 46203

    46203 Member

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    Image 23-21. 7027 Barry 16.09.jpg

    7027 @ Barry, September 1966.
     
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  8. Jamessquared

    Jamessquared Nat Pres stalwart

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    Are we talking Steam Railwsy magazine here, or the GWS?

    Tom
     
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  9. GWR4707

    GWR4707 Nat Pres stalwart

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    Like all locomotives they will appeal to different people in differing ways, for instance by old man is beyond excited about 2999 (he still hasn't managed to see her in the flesh yet as his mobility isn't great so Didcot's a non-starter and the SVR is too far for them to drive these days, we are hoping (and praying) that she gets to the GWSR soon!) but that's mainly as he worked inside in the late 50's and early 60's and from talking about locomotives with the trials drivers and inspectors the general thing he remembers was that all drivers waxed lyrical about the Saints when asked why were their favourites. He feel similar about 4079 as she was a 'special one' etc etc, pretty nonplussed about the 47xx and has offered no opinion ever re a new star, I can say that a Dean Single would get his juices flowing but he accepted years back that it would never happen in his lifetime.

    I imagine that Joe Public who make up the bulk of the GWS's core earnings could not give a toss between a Hall and a Saint or a 28xx v 47xx, the whole place rather struggles as to what it is. So if they want to show how things evolved just spend a few k's on a steel boiler for the 47XX chassis and she can be hauled in and out on steam days.

    As for them ending up on static display, who knows, I have a suspicion something like the 47XX would be most at risk from that fate due to its limited practicality, but as with everything else if someone wanted to fund an overhaul its up to them, similarly I have a sneaking fear that the King may not be overhauled for some time as if you want high profile roving ambassadors the Castles etc could fill that gap.

    I will say it again, if they are looking at practical new builds something like an Armstrong Goods would fill a gaping gap in the chronology and be very handy both on site and elsewhere.
     
  10. Matt37401

    Matt37401 Resident of Nat Pres

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    Both?
     
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  11. 61624

    61624 Part of the furniture

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    There's a lot of indignation about this, but how much of that indignation will translate into the hard cash needed? Very little of what is needed I suspect. The point has been made that a society can be set up, but I think people are harking back to the Barry days, when many such societies were set up. In most cases it took many, many years to get engines restored to steam, especially those that went on to the main line. As time has gone by the cost of restoration to main line condition has escalated, and how many societies are struggling to keep their engines there? The pool of people who will support such schemes is dying out. What will become of the main line fleet once there are no longer any main line opportunities. I think it will be very hard to sell a 7027 society on the grounds that it was once "the pride of Worcester shed" or that it was " the only BR-built, single chimney Castle, that was built with a 3-row superheated boiler" when it will be in competition with other projects with better selling points. That's my position but as I'm not interested GWR locos (I'd rather support an LNER-new build) but whoever takes it on has to consider the point if it is not to die a lingering death by disinterest.
     
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  12. Sidmouth

    Sidmouth Resident of Nat Pres Staff Member Moderator

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    the trouble is the ill feeling generated by the cannibalisation will knock back 4709 fund raising efforts as well so you are in a lose lose scenario

    a post appeared on facebook actually from Bulgaria and this is the facebook translation of it

    What restoration means to me... , it means to pay homage to the first master, it means to touch the owner's story, it means touch the energy, and it means to give a new life!
     
  13. Mr Valentine

    Mr Valentine Member

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    The two companies share the same address, but are otherwise independent of each other. This did create a bit of a conundrum a few years back during museum accreditation, but I think they managed to come up with a workaround.
     
  14. Kylchap

    Kylchap Member

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    Apart from being visually nostalgic, how effective is 2999 compared to, say, a Hall or a genuine Saint? I've heard it said that it couldn't pull the skin off a rice pudding, but I don't suppose that matters with the work it's given to do.
     
  15. mdewell

    mdewell Well-Known Member Friend

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    I don't read Steam Railway so cannot comment on their content.
    GWS do at least write their own stuff (Whether you like what they write or not is another matter.)
     
  16. mdewell

    mdewell Well-Known Member Friend

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    I would be very surprised if it's tractive effort is significantly difference to either a Hall or original Saint (shame there's not one of those to directly compare it to. ;):D)
     
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  17. Greenway

    Greenway Part of the furniture

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    https://preservedbritishsteamlocomotives.com/7027-thornbury-castle/
    https://www.4709.org.uk/4709blog/4709-group-buys-thornbury-castle

    A look at 7027.

    There is much conjecture about this loco on here and elsewhere. For instance her previous owner said it would remain at GCR not run mainline. As far as I can see the loco is sold and presumably paid for so why should the new owners resell it? JJP has shown an interest but only as shareholder, it won't be solely his and whatever the right and wrongs are it will the new owners decision to make regarding 7027's future.
    Incidentally 7027 is a BR loco - 1949 - and not GWR








    i
     
  18. Lord Belborough

    Lord Belborough New Member

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    It's very good. Coped very well at the SVR Spring steam gala alongside the likes of Sir Nigel Gresley hauling 8 coach trains. I'm not aware of any issues when it was at the NYMR last year. Lady of Legend has a strong following, not least as a Churchward era loco the smaller tender allows the public to get a good view of the driver and fireman unlike Clan Line and others which are very enclosed.
     
  19. Sidmouth

    Sidmouth Resident of Nat Pres Staff Member Moderator

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    Seemed to perform well on the SVR on long trains . from memory they did a lot of work to set it up although and others can correct me valve setting seemed to be a challenge

    as far as interest went it ceased when this happened

    [​IMG]Severn Valley Railway Spring steam up by Martin Creese, on Flickr

    The A1 group continuously market Tornado, relivery , look for opportunites to promote and sustain it . What have the GWS group done re 2999 ? Paint on the boiler looks like it is wearing thin . Costs of extraction from Didcot negate most lines for gala's . exactly the same will happen with 1014, 4079 , 4709
     
  20. Roger Thompson

    Roger Thompson Member

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    Me too, I wonder how the S & D Trust people will feel when they see that JJP is complaining about agreements made in good faith not being honoured. Their "agreement" with the West Somerset Railway was not just made in good faith, it was a legal contract agreed to by both sides, which JJP tore up when he became chairman.

    Sent from my SM-T590 using Tapatalk
     

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