Bluebell MK1 CK-16263 being offered up for sale

Hi all,

http://www.bluebell-railway.co.uk/bluebell/whats_new.html

is this because of the start of the overhaul of Bulleid CK No.5768?

Thanks

Andy

 

Andy, this vehicle is privately owned and suprisingly in very good condition.This is the same as the CK 16210

I suspect this is also a change in policy and the only team that could have restored are getting on a bit.

Regards
Chris

 

Yes it is otherwise we shall have an abundance of 1st class accommodation on the Railway should it ever be restored, and also I believe the man who bought and possibly still owns it may not have the time to restore it as he is busy on 5768, however im sure Mr Salmon can correct me + add to this.

 

I've also noticed SK 24458 has left the Bluebell. Does anyone know where this has gone?
Cheers
Steve

 

Dumb moment - can't see the details on that link. I'd like to know more.

 

The news article read:

 

Steve, I hope that 24458 new home has a lot of money to spare as it is reported that white asbestos is evident behind and under the seats.

There will be hell to pay if there is.

Regards
Chris

 

white asbestos is not really the béte noir the Asbestos remaoval industry would have you believe. Blue Asbestos can be very nasty if not handled properly but white is much more benign.

 

Nontheless in these days of H&S Critical Work both blue and white are treated the same.

Regards
Chris

 

absolutely, as a result of the industry demonising it...cute hoors as they'd say here

 

Chris, a number of factual corrections, if I may.

16263 is not privately owned; it is owned by the Bluebell Railway plc. It was originally selected as a vehicle capable of overhaul to a high standard, and it has been kept dry under a tarpaulin ever since it arrived on the Bluebell in 1991, so its good condition should not be a surprise.

Its sale has nothing whatsoever to do with the age of people in Roger's team - the youngest of whom (who did a lot of the skilled work on 2526) has more than 4 and a half decades to go before he draws his pension. And they are not the only team who could have tackled the work in any case. It has everything to do with the fact that we do not need 4 CKs for the long term. 1 Mk.1, 1 Bulleid and 1 Maunsell, plus 3 BCKs (2 Maunsell and a Mk.1) is quite enough corridor vehicles to ensure we can provide adequate first class compartment accommodation in the long term. This also fits in with the long-term aim to run three corridor sets (essentially 1 Mk.1, 1 Bulleid and 1 Maunsell).

As is stated on the carriage's web page, the main reason it is being offered for sale at this time is because we are starting the overhaul of the Bulleid CK 5768, which turns out to be in considerably better structural condition than any of us expected, with only one section of cant-rail affected by rot. 16263 was originally obtained because it was at that time felt unlikely that we'd be able to tackle 5768. Things move on in 18 years, and we are now, after all, tackling 5768, and confident that it can be overhauled in a suitable timescale to meet the Bluebell's traffic needs.

As for spreading scare stories about asbestos in 24458: I am quite certain our recently revised and updated asbestos register would have held any relevant information, and the purchaser would have asked to see it, as well as examining the vehicle. I very much doubt you have information to the contrary. As regards your assertion that there might be a problem in the future, the same situation would appertain in its sale as it did in its purchase by the Bluebell. After all, we only obtained the vehicle a couple of years ago, well after the last changes to the asbestos regulations.

Regards,
Richard

 

I had a friend who died of Asbestosis, two years ago this coming 9th December. Don't underestimate this foul material.

Regards

 

Causes Cancer doesn't it? Also has to be disposed off in the right manner and by professionals and is quite expensive to say the least...

 

im sorry to hear about your friend.

I did chose my words very carefully though...it's Blue Asbestos that really is the nasty (used to lag steam pipes and boilers mainly). White Asbestos needs to be treated with respect although it is nowhere near the nasty the Industry would have us believe.

 

Thank you for your very prompt reply Richard. 16263 was originally brought by Roger Williams and Tom Waghorn ,myself and others were still under the impression that he still did own it. It is appreciated that you have set the record straight.

As for restoring 5768, it will be great to see this back in traffic although within the timescale that you suggest might be difficult working in the old part of the shed.

Spreading asbestos scare stories about 24458?, absolute nonsense. I merely pointed out that from reliable information received this vehicle had asbestos behind and under the seats. That said of course I could easily be wrong and will humbly apologize on this forum on production on this thread, a scan of the page of said updated asbestos register which with your superior computer skills I know you can do.

Regards
Chris

 

An asbestos-free Mk1 is a relatively rare item and any informed purchaser would know to inquire/look - most MK 1s have it around the steam heating radiators under the seats but nowadays it is primarily white asbestos board, which is quite safe if left undisturbed. I believe that under current regulations, items of heritage rolling stock are exempt from rules that preventing them from being bought or sold - but any asbestos has to be dealt with in a professional manner when the need to disturb it arises.

I doubt if the Bluebell is in a different position in regard to the asbestos content of its Mk 1 stock than the Mid Hants, Glos Warks, West Somerset or Severn Valley to name but a few. I do know that the NYMR is gradually removing it as carriages are overhauled, but it is an expensive and disruptive process getting at all of it, so only two or three are done per year.

 

direct link....

http://www.bluebell-railway.co.uk/bluebell/pics/16263.html

 

Agreed, except that I believe it was the politicians, not the 'industry' that bundled all types of asbestos together, though the asbestos removal industry seems to be taking very great (financial) advantage of that legislative misjudgement.

As I understand it (from involvement in ensuring our products met worldwide legislation and company obligations in the 1980s) blue asbestos is needle-sharp and can impinge in the lining of the lungs when breathed in, staying there for years and sometimes causing cancer, often many years hence. White (chrysotile) asbestos, on the other hand, is serpentine in form so far less chance of impingement and it will dissolve in body fluids.

Of course, as AM says, even white asbestos needs to be treated with care, as does fibreglass and many other fibrous materials.

To bring the risk into perspective, I recall a well-researched scientific paper which stated that the pro rata incidence of cancer from exposure to cigarette smoke was 100,000 times greater than that of exposure to white asbestos.

.
edit: Though the politicians bundled all forms of asbestos together in their legislation, it could well have been the removal industry that lead them down that path, in which case my apologies to AM for doubting the accuracy of his statement!

 

im just glad you agree ;-)

 

Chris,
16263 was immediately transfered into railway ownership on arrival at the Bluebell. Just as with your statement elsewhere that Doris was privately owned, you have confused ownership with who put up the money to enable the Bluebell to purchase. Tom did indicate in his post that he was not certain (after all, he was rather young when the coach arrived, and it was also long before your involvement on Bluebell started).

5768 - what are you talking about? - it moves into the main works area next Monday. In any case the old part of the shed is not that bad - we restored 3 out of the four Mets there, and most of the work on the Birdcage has been done there - but clearly the main works area is much better!

Asbestos - Chris, your original post was simply an attempt to slur the Bluebell (and possibly libelous). Being in Tunis speaking at a conference at present, I am not in a position to borrow the asbestos register, take it home to scan and return it in a timely manner (even if I was allowed to take it off site, which I doubt).

Regards,
Richard