camcorder info. required.

Please can anyone out there help me, I'm wanting to get a camcorder one that can be recommended by someone real and not a review website etc. I'm after one that takes good images and has good colour, sharpness and clarity,any info will be greatly appreciated, many thanks
Wardy.

 

How much do you want to pay?

 

up to about £400ish depending on the quality....

 

Ok. Now you have to go through a list of features you want. Eye level viewfinder? external mic? HD? record to which media (HDD, card etc)? and so on ... Depending on the features you want the camera will cost more or less.

For the basics, I think that Canon lenses are better than Sony (Zeiss) or Panasonic (Leica). Sony AWB seems to be better than Canon or Panasonic, but I've always found Canon to be good enough. Canon auto focus is much better than the others which I feel is really important when zooming in or out on an engine. All three manufacturers give really good hi-fi audio. I think an external mic is essential, you get too much wind noise with the internal mics on cameras.

Are you going to specialise in filming or just place the camera on a tripod and let the train go by while taking stills on your DSLR? If you are going to pan you will need a tripod with a fluid head.

I'm not recommending these cameras as such, but look at the features they offer and compare.

http://www.jessops.com/online.store/products/77059/show.html

http://www.jessops.com/online.store/products/77165/show.html

Go to Amazon or Ebay and see what you will get second hand. I have a Canon HG10, now out of production, I can recommend that and it's brothers the HG20/30, but it is more than you want to pay. http://www.amazon.co.uk/Canon-Ultra-Compact-Definition-widescreen-Multiangle/dp/B000UJHOU0.

I appreciate that I haven't come out with a straightforward recommendation. But your purchase is going to depend to a large extent on the features you want. Go through the list of features and decide and if the result is more expensive that you would prefer, try second hand.

Regards

 

Thanks for that info you have been very helpful, I had been looking at a panasonic the sd60 but wasn't too sure and then you mentioned about the canon lenses being better and now I'm genning up on these, once again many thanks,
Wardy

 

My current camcorder is an old Sony Handycam which records to mini DV tape - now held together with gaffer tape after being blown over on the tripod, it still works and gives reasonable SD quality footage.

I recently tried one of the budget end newer Handycams (SD not HD) with disk drive (sorry can't remember the model) - picture quality was abysmal despite being set to the highest quality setting. The compression applied made it look like it was filmed through the bottom of a milk bottle - result - I took the camera back and got a refund. I shall continue with my current camera until it ceases to work, then decide what to invest in a decent HD camcorder.

STEVE

 

Until this september for the last two years I have been using canon, Hg20 and hg21, for the price bracket you are look at I would recommend the equivalent HF camera which users a memory card, you can record around 4 hours on a 32gig memory using around 17-20mb. Critic point even you you can't afford it initially is to have a microphone socket. I did have sony HDC-HS3 before that, but transferring HD tape to computer can be temperamental and takes an age. Using a memory card is much easer as you just plug in and go.

For the record I change to a Panasonic hdc-sd700 in September which is a bit more expensive but its with it.

Another critical requirement is a good Tripod that pans smoothly, a top end velborn is good starter, around 50-100 pound depending on the model, I started out with one myself.

 

Well I must say thanks again for info recieved, I have just been talking to a neighbour of mine who recently purchased a panasonic sd60 so she could film her sons wedding and I must say the result is very very good I am really impressed with it and the camera, so I think i'll be treating myself to one of those or the sd600, thanks again
wardy

 

I have the SD60, I thinks its fantastic, it has wind noise suppression, ok up to about 40mph out of the window . For those with an unsteady hand it has great stabilisation. Memory cards are cheap from www.memorybits.com. The only thing I don't like about it is the poor battery life, about 2 hours but a universal 12v litho battery charger has sorted that out.

Pixmania were the cheapest when I got mine

 

I'm going to be wanting one thats easy to grab and run... quick start, good focusing (i.e. Zooming).
My defacto "test circuit" is.. Plat 9 waterloo.. run to a clapham train with 5 mins to spare.. run to Plat 2/3 at Clapham zoom to GW junction.. catch it coming up crossing the points zoom out and pan as it passes plat 4.


So Not bulky, quick start, good zooming, good focusing, light weight... oh a decent Battery.. the kind which would last a day at a gala.

Anything else... yes I like to stick it out of a window at speed.

No into internal hard disks... they break. Memory card is just fine.

So Any reccomendations for a HD Cam that can do that job about 2x a month ?

Oh I almost forgot the important part.. Ive got an 8 week old girl, which my wife will use hours and hours of disk space on

 

I used to use DV tape on a Panasonic camera but found that transfering data to computer by firewire was a serious quality issue and it took a long time. Much prefer present method of USB which is available on HD cameras.

I agree with 'pennysteam' about the tripod although I found that Velbron weren't too great and there seems to be no after sales service. I currently use a Manfrotto tripod and fluid head. There is a compromise to be reached concerning the weight of the tripod and portability. A tripod which is too light might tip while panning, but a heavy one will be difficult to cart about.

I was interested in 'spindizzy's comments re wind noise on internal mics. All the cameras I've tried have been utterly hopeless at suppressing wind noise and it can be an issue on external mics too.

All the best to 'wardy', please post to YouTube when you get some results!

Regards

 

Recently bought an S50 (essentially the same but with SD cards rather than a hard drive and no high def) and, though I haven't used it extensively yet, it seems pretty decent. It's not a world beater, but it's a good budget model if you're not yet ready to commit to HD. I'd imagine Panasonic's HD version would live up to this standard really - not as good as a Canon, but pretty solid quality. I would agree that you probably don't really want a hard drive - it's down to use of course. If you go out for several days at a time, taking several hours of video, then yes, a hard drive model is a good idea. However, bear in mind this feature will push up the price considerably (shop salesmen will no doubt tell you that it works out cheaper than SD cards, and it does if you pay shop prices for the cards, but they're available for pennies on ebay!). Also bear in mind that a hard-drive based camcorder will turn itself off to protect the hard-drive in a shaking environment - earthquakes aside you'll be fine lineside, but try to use it on a brake van and you may struggle - I did with my previous one. I also found, as ADB968008 said, they break... And when they do, it's damn near impossible to retrieve the footage, even with well-equipped IT techies on your side! Ok, you'll probably have most of it saved on a computer anyway, but you can guarantee the day's footage you lose when the camcorder breaks will be some of your best! (In my case, 73129 at Keighley, reading 125dB at one stage!). Have the same problems with an SD card camcorder, and you can simply remove the card - complete with your footage - to use in any SD-compatible camcorder.

Another feature to bear in mind is battery life. The standard batteries supplied with these camcorders tend to be quite unsuitable for a day or weekend's filming at a railway (which I'm assuming is what you have in mind). Personally, I've always bought a huge ****-off battery online, £20-£30 tends to buy you as much power as you could reasonably use in a weekend, without having to keep replacing batteries. The reason I mention this is much of the Canon range now have the battery mounted inside the camcorder, inserted into the bottom*, rather than on the back - designed for better weight distribution, I'm told, but it does limit you to a standard power battery, as the larger ones (unless you buy right at the top of the range) are physically larger, as well as having a higher capacity...

Personally after only a few weeks I'm quite a fan of the simplicity of the standard def Panasonic range - learning how to use it took me 10 minutes waiting for departure from Bury! - I'd imagine the HD range is large similar in its controls. Also, consider which features you NEED. Add it up in a shop and a hard-drive model works out cheaper; look at the prices of SD cards online and you'll quickly change your mind! The money I saved by opting for the SD card model has allowed me to buy ample battery power and plenty of SD cards. You can also consider SD cards to be an investment - they'll work with any SD compatible camcorder, whilst that hard-drive, when your camcorder eventually dies, is useless. It's money you could save next time around - might even allow you to get a significantly better model...


* - The fact that the phrase 'inserted into the bottom' appears fine suggests that the forum doesn't have a spam filter! :lol:

 

I accept the argument concerning SD cards, but their very size creates issues for storage and making notes on them so you can find the footage you need, when you need it. My stills camera uses them and I find them to be very fiddly, but I cannot answer RalphW's comment re the longevity of SD cards. Personally the HDD is a better way as I go away on weekends quite often and the greater data storage of the HDD gives me a shoot and forget option. It also removes the situation of running out of storage towards the end of the card and having to change it quickly in order not to lose the shot!

I know people are worried about the reliability of HDDs, but in 25 yrs or so of using HDDs on desktops, laptops, (and more recently) netbook and camera I've never had an issue with losing data and the camera, laptops and netbook have come in for some pretty rough accidental treatment. I back up all data to two external HDDs at home and when I'm away I back up the camera to a netbook.

If you are concerned about the capacity of your batteries go on line and search for alternatives. There are lots of entrepreneurs in China who produce cheap batteries and in my experience they're very good. When I bought my first camera, a Panasonic, I bought two additional batteries and I did much the same for my current Canon HG10. The batteries were advertised on Amazon, they were bought from a firm in California and they actually came from Hong Kong! When I did my week in North Wales in August I left my battery charger at home but I didn't need it; the batteries provided all the power I needed without recharging.

Clearly there are a number of options and each must take the choice which suits them. I prefer HD on a HDD camera. High Definition is a very definite plus in my view, the clarity, focus and colour saturation of HD makes it far and away a better way of watching the telly.

Regards

 

25 years of being lucky at home and at work. I don't think its luck, but in spite of that I back everything up, everything.

Regards

 

32gig will shoot around 4hours in the best guilty, Before I opted for use memory card I checked what was the longest footage I have recorderd, in gigs. Steal steam and stars if which I did 6 out of 9 days came in at 27gig. Around the same was a weeks trip to north wales. Just to be on the safe side I have another 16gig card as well. As for long term, well I get home and transfer the card to hard disk and then back it up,so labelling doesn't really come into it.