HELP NEEDED! Maunsell Locomotive Drawings and Tender Info

Hi all,

I'm currently making a few models of some Maunsell Locomotives for a train simulation game. The N15, S15, Q, and the U Classes. So far I have I have progressed nicely with the N15 model, although I am looking at where I can get suitable drawings for the other 3 locos I intend to build. My first question is: Where can I find drawings of these locos? Are there any books that have drawings of all of these locos in?

My second question is: What tenders ran with which class? Being a GWR man I have no real knowledge of SR tenders, at least not Maunsell tenders. From pictures I see the Q and U mostly used the 6 wheel tenders, and the S15 used both the 6 wheelers and the bogie tenders, although not the type of tender 30777 currently runs with.

Any help would be smashing.

Many thanks.

 

I dont know about what books would have the drawings , but as far as the tenders are concerned the U& Q classes used the same maunsel 6 wheeled tender some with inset coal raves some with flat section, the tender drawhooks were slightly different hights , so even though it was a standard Southern design of tender, there were detail differences. with the N15/S15 what tender depends on what division you want to model, south eastern used a short 6 wheel tender where as the southwestern used watercart bogie tenders of both the urie design and later maunsel type so in theory either type would be right , on the south eastern the locos had a different cab also

 

Maunsell society website engines_on_shed

 

Right. If you've got a minute, I'll be right back with a run-down of tender variations...

 

The Drummond and Urie volume of the LSWR Locomotives series have works drawings at the back and plenty of photos and info on the LSWR design tenders which operated with the locomotives you have mentioned.

 

Here goes (and this is just for the S15 class, with no mention of the various front-end modifications!), and I thoroughly recommend D. L. Bradley’s comprehensive efforts on LSWR locomotives for this sort of thing (and this is where I compiled most of this information from):

The S15 (like the N15) needs to be split into its main batches (although it is easier to simply divide the S15 into Urie and Maunsell types than the N15, which needs further splitting into its Urie, Maunsell ‘Eastleigh 1’, ‘Scotch’ and Maunsell ‘Eastleigh 2’ sub-batches).

Urie S15

First 20 (Nos. 496-515 built February 1920-May 1921) had the standard Urie-pattern 5,000 bogie tender. No. 515 was oil-fitted from June to October 1921, with a prominent oil tank in the coal space. It was re-fitted for oil firing again in 1926 during the General Strike.

Tenders appear to have remained fairly stationary until 1934, when it was decided to rebuild the LB&SCR ‘Baltic’ tanks Nos. 2327-2333 as 4-6-0 tender engines to shore-up express passenger rosters on the Western Section of the Southern. This decision was partially to reduce the use of the S15 on express passenger duties in order to increase their availability for heavy freight. As a result, the Urie 5,000 gallon bogie tenders were removed from Nos. 504-510 for attachment to what was to become the N15X class. In their place, the de-tendered S15s were fitted with Drummond ‘Watercart’ 4,000 gallon bogie tenders, which were previously attached to Nos. 290-296 of Drummond’s C8 class (the Urie 5,000 gallon bogie tender of No. 508 went to Maunsell S15 No. 833). Although the N15Xs proved somewhat a disappointment, it seems that these S15s retained these tenders beyond Nationalisation.

1954 was the next major change where tenders were concerned, as this was the year when several H15, N15 (Urie and Maunsell ‘Eastleigh 1’ types) and N15X locomotives were withdrawn, leaving several spare tenders. Life-expired standard Urie 5,000 gallon tenders were replaced on Nos. 30498/9 and 30503 with Urie 5,200 gallon (30498, 30503) and a Maunsell Ashford 4,000 gallon 6-wheel tender. The same happened to those still fitted with the Drummond ‘Watercart’ tenders, and were as follows:

Urie 5,200 bogie tenders attached to 30504, 30507
Urie 5,000 bogie tenders attached to 30505, 506, 508-510.

Maunsell S15

Maunsell ordered 15 more S15s in 1925/26, and of these, Nos. 823-832 were fitted with the standard Urie 5,000 gallon bogie tender. However, those attached to Nos. 828-832 had vacuum reservoirs prominently fitted to the water tank top behind the coal space. A final batch (Nos. 833-847) was ordered in 1931, which were paired with Maunsell’s own design of flush-sided semi-welded 5,000 gallon bogie tender. However, things get a little tricky from 1928, as a series of tender exchanges lasting nine years muddies the water quite a bit.

The Maunsell flush-sided tenders fitted to Nos. 838-847 were transferred for use behind the new ‘Lord Nelson’ class (namely Nos. 851/854-857). These locomotives subsequently received the standard Urie 5,000 gallon bogie tenders that were spare as a result of N15s Nos. 763/764/768/771/772 being fitted with Maunsell’s Ashford 4,000 gallon 6-wheel tenders for use on the shorter turntables of the Eastern Section.

Soon after, the 5,000 gallon bogie tenders with vacuum cylinders fitted to Nos. 828-832 were swapped with the Ashford 4,000 gallon 6-wheel tenders originally fitted to ‘Lord Nelsons’ Nos. 852/853, and to provide tenders for under-construction Nos. 858-860. 828-832 were then fitted with standard Urie 5,000 gallon bogie tenders that were spare as a result of N15s Nos. 765-767/769/770 being fitted with Maunsell’s Ashford 4,000 gallon 6-wheel tenders for use on the Eastern Section. HOWEVER, for modelling this period, it must be noted that No. 769 was transferred from Battersea to the Western Section, and was not fitted with an Ashford 4,000 gallon tender as originally intended. Instead, it had brand-new Maunsell flush-sided, semi-welded 5,000 gallon bogie tender fitted.

The final exchange prior to the Second World War was with those Eastern Section N15s transferred back to Nine Elms around 1935-1936 (Nos. 763-767). As a result, S15s Nos. 833-837 received Maunsell Ashford 4,000 gallon 6-wheel tenders prior to transfer to the Eastern Section. HOWEVER, No. 833 lost its original Urie 5,000 gallon bogie tender tender to N15X No. 2329 in 1934, subsequently running with the Drummond ‘Watercart’ 4,000 gallon bogie tender from C8 No. 294 until 1935. It then received Urie 5,000 gallon bogie tender from Urie S15 No. 508.

Bradley states that the tender position at the end of these exchanges were as thus:

Urie 5,000 gallon bogie tenders – Nos. 823-832
Maunsell flush-sided 5,000 gallon bogie tenders – Nos. 838-847
Maunsell Ashford 4,000 gallon 6-wheel tender – Nos. 833-837

In 1942, Nos. 833-837 were returned to the Western Section, but retained their 4,000 gallon tenders for the duration, and tenders remained stationary until Nationalisation. However, in 1960, No. 30847 was transferred to Redhill from Salisbury to bolster that shed’s allocation, and was fitted with the small Maunsell Ashford 3,500 gallon 6-wheel tender. Three other tenders were swapped, 30833 and 30912 were fitted with Maunsell Ashford 4,000 gallon tenders (although raves were turned inwards for use with the ‘Schools’ class), whilst 30825 had a Urie 5,000 gallon bogie tender fitted.

In other words, the tender situation with Urie/Maunsell locomotives is a complete minefield! But for works drawings and photographs, Bradley’s LSWR locomotives series from RCTS/Wild Swan Publications (now long out-of-print and quite expensive to get) takes some beating, as guard_jamie hints.