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Industrial Loco Updates

Discussion in 'Steam Traction' started by AlistairS, Apr 17, 2008.

  1. sleepermonster

    sleepermonster Member

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    Work on The Duke has gone steadily forwards; the first two rings of outer cladding are in place, but the third set were beyond use: part of one sheet was missing, cut off, and the other was riddled with tinworm. The only solution is to make and form the two steel sheets required. The first problem is that the sheets required are near as makes no difference 2 m by 1,68 m, and the nearest available from Twiggs were 2m x 1m, which would have to be welded and then cut to size. The second problem is that both sheets would have to be formed to toughly an inverted j shape to fit around the firebox.

    The 48624 team have always maintained a close interest in the contents of the scrap skip, and a couple of weeks before they had spotted some rather rusty Dexion racking which they hauled out and his in our No.2 van on the basis that "it might come in handy". It did! the shelf units were laid out on their backs under Cemetery Lane Bridge, which became our fabrication shop for one last day of good autumn weather. The steel sheets were supported on planks on the units and John and Mick did the welding and trimming, which went very well. Mick had also brought with him a large wooden fabrication which looked like the skeleton of a 1960's pub juke box; in fact it is a former for the curved top of the firebox and he has begun bending the first of the sheets round it.

    The boiler cladding is being painted with black weatherproof primer from T R Williamson, unlike red oxide, which is porous and shows rust after a while, this paint keeps water away from the metal. Ultimately the locomotive will be red gloss.

    The next Dapol wagons for sale in aid of The Duke have just arrived - Buggleskelly Gas, and Buggleskelly Quarries Tarmacadam, £15 each.
     
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  2. Jamessquared

    Jamessquared Nat Pres stalwart

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    This was on Facebook:

    STAMFORD TO STAY IN RUTLAND
    Fifty years of ironstone quarrying at Pilton in rural Rutland finally came to an end on 7th June 1969 when quarry steam locomotive STAMFORD worked its last train-load of ironstone at Pilton Ironstone Quarry.

    Upon closure the STAMFORD locomotive assisted with track lifting on the quarry railway as required until October of that year when it was secured for preservation and taken to the Bluebell Railway in East Sussex.

    In 2010 the locomotive returned to Rutland on loan to Rocks by Rail – the Living Ironstone Museum situated near Cottesmore.
    Last year the Bluebell Railway agreed to sell this historic locomotive and the Museum launched a campaign to raise funds to retain STAMFORD within Rutland and to conserve it as a museum exhibit on public display.

    Built by the Avonside Engine Company in Bristol in 1927 and delivered direct to Pilton, STAMFORD is one of only a very few steam locomotives which worked in Rutland’s ironstone quarries to survive into preservation.

    The museum is now delighted to announce that fund raising to acquire the locomotive has been successful and that STAMFORD will now be staying in Rutland, where it spent all its working life.

    The Museum Trustees would like to thank Cottesmore Parish Council, Museum Members and the public for making donations to secure the loco’s purchase.
    Whilst the purchase price has been raised, the Appeal Fund will remain open and the museum would be pleased to receive any other donations, large or small, which would enable us to ensure that this historic 94-year-old steam locomotive can be repaired and conserved.

    The Museum would welcome any offers of help and donations in the furtherance of this project. Any donations by way of cheques should marked on rear “Stamford Loco Appeal” and be made out to Rutland Railway Museum and sent to:

    Mr A Salmon, RbR Treasurer, 4 Main Street, Stanford on Soar, Loughborough LE12 5PY

    For donors willing to donate as Gift Aid there is an RbR Gift Aid Form which is available via email from the Curator
    email: Curator@rocks-by-rail.org

    For donors wanting to make their gift by bank transfer please contact the Treasurer for these details on email andysam@stayfree.co.uk
    Rocks by Rail - The Living Ironstone Museum, Cottesmore Iron Ore Mines Sidings, Ashwell Road, Cottesmore, Rutland LE15 7FF
    Tel: 01572 868415​
    Tom
     
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  3. William Fletcher

    William Fletcher New Member

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    Has Sentinel 9376 been weighed in? Pcitre on Facebook shows it having given parts to other locos and being lifted out of Elsecr
     
  4. Fireline

    Fireline Member

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    @mikehartuk, are you able to help with the status of 9376?
     
  5. mikehartuk

    mikehartuk New Member

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    I’m very proud of my three restored standard gauge working steam locomotives. On top of those three since 2010 I’ve also owned Sentinel No. 9376 built in 1947 and known as No.7 - but that we never have got round to putting back into working order. I’ve felt for a while it was time for a cold hard look at what to do with No 7 and had in mind that there are several others of the same type in preservation.

    While No. 7 was largely complete when I purchased it we've inevitably slowly robbed it of parts over the years to help keep my two working Sentinel steam locos ‘Gervase’ and ‘William’ going. The engine cylinders were the first to go being taken off to replace those that cracked on ‘William’. It's boiler was then taken out and dismantled into its two separate firebox and outer shell sections, shotblasted, and painted to ensure it was preserved in good order. I now look on that as a spare boiler for ‘Gervase’ and ‘William’. More recently No 7’s wheelsets were taken out and put under ‘William’ when it suffered axle damage.

    Then, a few months back I was approached by the owners of Sentinel No 7232 ‘Ann’ based at the East Lancs Railway. Theirs is a much older loco, and rarer, 1927 built loco that they had put all their youthful energies into restoring only to find the internals of its high speed gear box were missing. That left them with just the low ratio box that only gives a max loco speed of about 4 mph. In deciding to bite the bullet with my already part dismantled loco I felt I ought to let them have the high ratio gearbox from No 7, with its associated heavy output drive shaft, so they could start having much more fun with their engine. Running up their mainline was otherwise unpractical unless you had a full day to spare to get there and back! Earlier this month, with their help, we removed the engine unit for me to keep as a spare and for them to take away the gearbox parts they needed to supercharge Sentinel ‘Ann’ up to 15 mph – and so have a much more useful loco to enjoy. The remaining carcass of No 7 then went off to the scrap yard.

    Sad perhaps, but sensible and pragmatic was my view.

    Mike
     
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  6. Steve

    Steve Resident of Nat Pres Friend

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    I hope you kept the springs and anything else that might come in useful. I'm sure that you will have, though.
     
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  7. William Fletcher

    William Fletcher New Member

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    Thank you Mike, that's much appreciared. Sad indeed, but it has helped other engines to continue.
     
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  8. estwdjhn

    estwdjhn Member

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    Symbolic moment at Foxfield on Saturday, as our loco superintendent removed the nameplates from the Vintage Carriages Trust's Bellerophon, as the first act of her next overhaul. (In the archives, we've also a picture of him putting the plates back on 14.5 years ago as the final act of the previous overhaul!)

    There are still quite a few other bits to come off and go back on again but she will hopefully be back charging up Foxfield bank again before too long.

    It's hoped that a few features will be altered to a correct period spec - in particular careful study of old photographs reveal that the cab front sheet is about 4" too far forward on the boiler. The story behind this is complex, but it appears that the cab brackets on the current boiler are to suit the longer cabs on the last two Haydock engines, and in working days there were quite substantial packers fitted between the brackets and Bellerophon's cab. What we haven't completely got to the bottom of yet is working out if this means the boiler we have was built for Bellerophon, but as one of a batch with the brackets all the same (at least some of the six Haydock engines got new boilers in the 1920s, including Bellerophon), or if the boilers got swapped round, and the boiler we have originally started out life on one of the others.
     

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  9. Jamessquared

    Jamessquared Nat Pres stalwart

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    Co-incidentally, this popped up on my feed:



    Tom
     
  10. alexl102

    alexl102 New Member

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    Does anyone know what the long-term plan is for MW 1601 Matthew Murray at Middleton? I know it's out of ticket; is it fairly high up the overhaul queue or likely to go on display for a few years?
     
  11. Richard Roper

    Richard Roper Well-Known Member

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    Interesting video... It says that the current boiler is from Makerfield, fitted in 1950... If this is true, that would probably account for the discrepancies.
    It was always a pleasure seeing Bellerophon in steam on the KWVR, having seen it for several years in the corner of Haworth Yard awaiting its turn for restoration.
    Lovely loco., and with a useful TE too!
    Maybe if I live to be 104, I'll see Bellerophon's 200th anniversary!

    Richard.
     
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  12. Steve

    Steve Resident of Nat Pres Friend

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    There are currently no plans to overhaul MW 1601, which is on display in the Engine House. Although the loco has a good boiler, being only 22 years old, its cylinder block is in poor condition, a common fault with inside cylinder locomotives. In any case, the Railway currently has four operational steam locos. NER 1310 will come out of service in May but should be replaced by MW 1210 Sir Berkeley. The next loco to come out of service will be 2027 with HE 2387 Brookes No.1, which should be replaced by HC 1544 Slough Estates No3 before then. That takes it to 2029 when S 8837 is planned to come out of service but it is not yet decided which loco to overhaul to replace this and who knows what will be happening by then?
     
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  13. estwdjhn

    estwdjhn Member

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    That video isn't definitive. I know the source, and at the time it was made I was trying to get to the bottom of what had occurred by tracking the various changes to the engine's appearance (particularly the smokebox - there are flush riveted, snap head riveted and welded versions in different photos from different eras).

    My current best guess is that the boiler is the one built for her in the 20s, but as one of a batch, and no one thought to alter the brackets compared to the later engines until they tried to refit the cab to Belle.

    I'm in with a shout of still being just about fit to crew her for her 200th birthday, and certainly very much hope to see it!
     
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  14. alexl102

    alexl102 New Member

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    Thanks for clarifying Steve! Last time I was at Middleton, 1601 was still tucked away in the engine shed, away from the public eye, so nice to know it's on display. And I'm really glad the railway will still have at least one MW in service; they're quintessential MR to me!
     
  15. Steve

    Steve Resident of Nat Pres Friend

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    The small Manning Wardle's are indeed the quintessential Leeds built locomotive and, along with similar products from Hunslet and Hudswell Clarke, were everywhere in Victorian and Edwardian times, effectively the JCB's of that era. Just look how many of the locomotives known to have been used in the construction of the Manchester Ship Canal came from the Hunslet district of Leeds. (151 of 175 locos). It would be good to have MW 1601 back in steam but the Railway can't really justify having five steam locos in service as a routine. There's the obvious cost grounds but the more you have, the more time and effort you have to spend on maintenance. Besides which, there's HC 1309, HC 1369, HC 1882 and HE 1493 all waiting in the wings for another 10 years of use.
     
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  16. Paul Grant

    Paul Grant Member

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    Is there a policy for the way the MR decides what's next for overhaul and is there any of the collection that are considered "Out Of Bounds" for restoration for various reasons? Picton is high odds of never going to happen but something like 1684 is the sort of curiousity that would fit right into the fleet.
     
  17. Steve

    Steve Resident of Nat Pres Friend

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    We don't have a definite policy on what's next for an overhaul but look at various things, such as which has been out of service the longest but, it also comes down to what are peoples favourites and that differs from person to person. I'd like to see 1684 running and, as you say, it would be ideal for the railway. it's also a unique survivor. However, it hasn't steamed since the 1960's and has spent most of that time outside and open to the elements. This has taken its toll in a big way. It needs a new boiler (or at least a substantial part of one), wheel tyres, crank pins and most of the platework above and including the running plate and that's before a close inspection is carried out. The big problem is that the loco is not owned by the Railway and we are reluctant to spend the sort of money required in such circumstances and grant applications would probably fall down for the same reason. If it was owned by the Railway, circumstances might well change. At least it's under cover for the moment.

    Picton is in a similar but worse condition than 1684, although it does have good wheel tyres*. It's not a candidate for restoration, other than possibly cosmetic. Although standard gauge, it is far too wide for UK lines, being over 10 feet across the motion brackets.

    * The reason it has good tyres is because the sugar railway in Trinidad where it worked had no facilities for turning wheel tyres. It could re-tyre wheels, though, so when tyres became worn, new tyres were fitted.:)
     
  18. Paul Grant

    Paul Grant Member

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    Thanks for the insight Steve. I didnt realise 1684 wasnt owned by the the railway. But like you say, it's under cover.
     
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  19. Cullen

    Cullen New Member

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    Picton is a most impressive machine and was justifiably saved as a rare example in the UK of the many British locomotives specifically built for overseas service. It is good to see that Picton has been conserved and sheltered and the tyres do indeed appear to have plenty of potential use left in them. It is a pity that the tanks and cab had to be removed as the present condition of the locomotive makes it harder to see the "Hunslet with a difference" appearance that can be seen in pictures as built.

    If restored, Picton could show these aspects very well if exhibited under cover in the Middleton Railway's excellent locomotive exhibition hall. I can understand that there may be little appetite or budget for restoration work (volunteer or otherwise) to be done on a locomotive which cannot be used, even if (as I understand it) all of the builder's drawings are available and the locomotive uses standard Hunslet parts.

    I however also understand that Picton's motion brackets fit within the Nene Valley Railway's loading gauge, so it does appear that there is a preserved line in the UK on which the locomotive could run if it were to be restored. The size of the cab would make Picton a very interesting locomotive for driver experience courses. Whilst it is good to see co-operation between different preserved railways for visiting locomotives, the case of Picton poses a considerable challenge given the current condition of the locomotive and the likely costs of restoration. British builders once exported hundreds, if not thousands, of locomotives to the rest of the world. Given Picton's historic significance as a reminder of this vanished export market, I understand that grant funding was obtained for conservation of the locomotive and for the construction of the shelter where it currently sits. Perhaps in the current climate of relaunching "Global Britain" there may be official appetite for further grant funding to restore Picton to use?
     

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