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Jacobite 2024

Discussion in 'What's Going On' started by alastair, Nov 29, 2023.

  1. 3ABescot

    3ABescot Member

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    You may be right about them not being parasites, but the fact remains that they concentrate to much on the rail side of the brief and seem to ignore the wild west of the road system. The problem is of course political, doubtless the ruling junta have prevented them addressing the daily threats faced by pedestrians and cyclists. For those few carefully investigated cases you mention you note there are thousands of deaths and injuries on the roads. Obvious remedies like restricting cars to the limits, or their width to the scale of our roads and parking bays are blocked by self-serving politicians who have tried to dump the problems onto local authorities, whom they then castigate for trying to do their job with costly complicated tools like ULEZ zones and low traffic areas.
    And leave the doubtless conscientious people in the ORR to concentrate on the Rail part of the brief whilst having to ignore the Road elephant in the room.
     
  2. JBTEvans

    JBTEvans Part of the furniture

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    So what's so special that exempts heritage railways then?
     
  3. JBTEvans

    JBTEvans Part of the furniture

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    No different to a heritage railway.
     
  4. Enterprise

    Enterprise Part of the furniture

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    Whatever the merits of your other points, if I look back over my lifetime this seems risible nonsense.
     
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  5. Jamessquared

    Jamessquared Nat Pres stalwart

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    Since the accident at the GCR, I think you’ll find that heritage railways have had, where they didn’t previously exist, to introduce operating methods for running trains longer than their platforms.

    Tom
     
  6. JBTEvans

    JBTEvans Part of the furniture

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    Yeah, and rightly so. Still makes the shorter platforms on the WHL no different though.
     
  7. Paul Grant

    Paul Grant Well-Known Member

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    A quick bit of googling finds a Maria Wilson in Fort William who runs a Harry Potter shop in Mallaig and at one point, the gift stall on the Jacobite itself.
     
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  8. steam_mad

    steam_mad Member

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    Interesting reading comments in several places about how WCRC have had 10/20 years to fit CDL. The ORR were still consulting operators of MK1 stock as late as 2020 about what the requirement for Regulation 5 exemptions beyond March 2023. Following that consultation, the ORR announced the current requirements in summer 2021.

    Evidently even the ORR realised that a 2 year timescale to fit CDL following their decision was not long enough, hence the current temporary derogations in place for Belmond and Vintage Trains.

    WCRC were not the only operator to feedback during the consultation process that, on the basis of strong safety records during the last exemption period CDL should not be required (which I understand was also the opinion of the Heritage Trains Risk Group set up by the RSSB).

    The difference of course is that WCRC went on to challenge the ORR through the courts (which they were within their rights to do), whilst other operators accepted the requirement to run beyond March 2023 and began to sort designs and fitment plans for their stock.
     
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  9. Scrat

    Scrat New Member

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    Not currently fitting CDL, 5 year exemption on the cards.....
     
  10. Andy Williams

    Andy Williams Member

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    I have heard that the current WCR application for a CDL exemption in respect of the Jacobite trains is based on operating the service at a 25 MPH maximum speed in order to take advantage of the current exemptions afforded to heritage railway operators. However this might not be universally popular with other train operating companies operating over that route due to its effect on timetabled and conditional train paths. We shall have to see what transpires once the ORR have consulted with all interested parties.
     
    Last edited: Mar 23, 2024
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  11. Johnb

    Johnb Nat Pres stalwart

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    I know Maria and she also has a souvenir shop at Fort William Station. Soon after the train arrives at Mallaig her HP shop is besieged by families off the train. She stands to lose a lot of business from the loss of the Jacobite.
     
  12. Johnb

    Johnb Nat Pres stalwart

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    I think that option has already been turned down.
     
  13. MellishR

    MellishR Resident of Nat Pres Friend

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    One important difference is that ORR themselves enforce the laws applying to railways, whereas enforcement of the laws applying to road users is down to the police, who seemingly lack the resources to do so very effectively.
     
  14. 35B

    35B Nat Pres stalwart

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    If so, that would be an interesting attempt to rewrite the legislation which is clearly written to create a carve out for heritage railways from the national network.


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
     
  15. 3ABescot

    3ABescot Member

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    That's all true and very relevant. I was referring mainly to law-making rather than enforcement though.
     
  16. jonathonag

    jonathonag Well-Known Member

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    However, it is an exemption that the NYMR trains to Whitby enjoy currently.
     
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  17. acorb

    acorb Part of the furniture

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    It really only affects Fort William to Glenfinnan which is 40mph, the rest of the trip is subject to a 30mph limit, so 25mph would be a negligible difference - same as Whitby.
    Could be a way of rescuing the season if negotiations are successful. However, of no use to the West Coast day trip sector.
     
  18. johnofwessex

    johnofwessex Resident of Nat Pres

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    More like the absence of Political Will
     
  19. Johnb

    Johnb Nat Pres stalwart

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    There could be other things to take into account, the engine crews would obviously know better than me but could they make it to the top of Beasdale Bank or up the Mhuidhe from 25 mph at the bottom?
     
  20. Miff

    Miff Part of the furniture Friend

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    Another important difference is ORR have no responsibility whatsoever (regulatory or otherwise) for the 97% of the UK road network which is the responsibility of other local, regional or national authorities - for which there is no independent or arms-length regulator. Might be a good idea if there was.

    In their roads remit ORR have only a very limited statutory responsibility for regulating & monitoring certain aspects of the performance of ‘National Highways’ - the gov’t owned body responsible for only about 4,500 miles (in England only, just the motorways and some A-roads) of the UK’s approx. total of 262,300 miles.
     
    Last edited: Mar 24, 2024

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