Lakelander Tours 2024

Not seen a thread for the upcoming Lakelander tour this weekend. Had a message suggesting either 34046 or 70000. Obviously the return is via the S&C due to the Coastal line being closed.

 

Be good to see 70000 over the northern fells again.

 

I believe it is Britannia but don’t shoot the messenger if it’s wrong.

 

That's an exciting prospect!
Fingers crossed it is 70000....
Do you know if there's any diesel involved?

 

There will be a diesel on the back yes. To power ETS

 

My usually reliable source (Shed 24H the café at Hellifield Station-well worth a visit) says it is Britannia.

 

Interestingly, last Saturday's Steam Dreams trip to Newcastle was (I believe) the first one run with a full rake of Mk1s, so no air con to worry about.

 

OK, thanks for the clarification.

 

There was one less carriage in the formation than usual - 7 Mk1 FOs compared to the 7 + 1 Mk2 on previous trips, but nice to see a full Saphos Mk1 set behind 60007 all the same.

 

True, but is a diesel still not necessary to power the CDL system? This is a genuine question as I do not know how LSL power the CDL on their Mk1s. So far they do seem to be the only people who have any loco hauled CDL Mk1s in operation.

Peter

 

It's air powered isn't it*, I assume the only reason they (and WCR) drag a diesel around is when they are using Mk2 CDL fitted stock as it has aircon.

*If the boot were on the other foot no doubt the Jeremyites would be out in force on SM conspiring that the absence of the diesel suggests that whilst the stock is CDL fitted it isn't being used!

 

You seem to be forgetting that non aircon stock often needs a diesel for train heating for much of the year these days. A mk1 train does not necessarily equate to a train without a diesel somewhere in the consist.

Peter

 

I wasn't forgetting anything, just not giving it much thought. One would assume that the train with SNG must have had a genny set in the consist somewhere then to keep the punters warm, unless SNG is ETS fitted now of course .

 

Having been on their MK1s I’m sure the ETS powers the heating and lighting too. I’m willing to be proven wrong one that but I’m 90% certain

 

LSL mk1’s have had the Dynamo Belts removed. Therefore, the set requires ETS supply to power all electrical aspects of the train. Relying on a diesel loco for this allows for greater operational flexibility also.

 

And presumably means that at times the lights will still be on below about 17mph

 

I knew you’d know

 

TRACTORS Pull in a BIG CROWD...! Loco Change at Shrewsbury 04/04/24 - YouTube


This video clearly shows the Riviera set is fully operable with just a generator car.
Network Rail 97s certainly don't have ETS.

 

Yes that’s true and the Saphos set could be operated the same. But a Genrator car doesn’t have the same effect if your steam loco fails, or you want to turn the whole train like LSL do at Carlisle, etc.

I favour the diesel on the back. Even as an enthusiast I can tell you if one of my trains at work was delayed/stuck behind a failed steamer, I’d be pretty p**sed off!

 

@2857Harry Without wishing to restart the diesel on back debate (which has been done to death), I posted the video purely to demonstrate that CDL doesn't have to mean the end of 'unassisted' steam as has been suggested. There were a certain number routes where steam was trusted* (more often than not) to take a train without 'company', the Riviera set shows this can continue post CDL if a TOC chooses.
Operationally, a TOC may decide a diesel on back is a better option (as LSL often does), but that is an operational, rather than technological, decision.

*N/B: steam's failure record on the mainline is actually very good compared to other traction as even if a steam loco is a bit poorly it can usually get to the place of safety - the 'insurance' argument has always been the weakest in my view! Reliable heating, operational flexibility and allowing an already overloaded train to run are far more genuine reasons for a D on B.