Possible way to add value to these threads

David Ward contributed two OS maps to the South Devon Railway thread, with potential photo opportunities circled in red. This could be really useful if standardised. If users could agree on an icon to use at the spot where a photo is taken (e.g. something similar to OS tourist maps' "Viewpoint" icon), perhaps guides could be produced in this format as far as possible.

Maybe the nearest legal parking, incl. lay-bys, could be added as an optional extra "P". Of course, posters would still be free, as now, to add text with insider tips like best time of day, best access route, beware of dog etc., as well as links to their own photos to whet appetites.

Perhaps David would like to tell us if the map is just a download from one of the usual mapping/navi software sites, and what he used to add the target circle.

Would any active supporters of the line involved be willing to take such a job on? After all, it's in their interest to keep photographers safe (and of course train crews), as well as to give people encouragement to visit their line.

I'm just floating a balloon here, what do people think?

 

NIce idea - but don't photographers and cameramen want their own unique locations, without the risk of other people getting in their shot? Or making any sort of noise while they record their video?

Richard

 

Those who want to keep "their" location secret won't post, simples. But it's just as likely that less egocentric souls will post about the exact same location.
Aha, so my idea wasn't that original [-( :smt002 . Personally I'd rather print off 3-4 OS sheets so I can refer to the map that I take with me in any case, but it's great to see such a site nevertheless.
But at Trainspots there's only one reference to the NNR, for example. Even Google Earth's Panoramia does better than that (if you overlook the numerous "steam train" captions for locos).

So whether you choose Trainspots, or David Ward's way, there's definitely still scope for providing convenient help to fotters.

 

As far as I can tell, the two OS maps posted do not carry a copyright statement. I may be wrong but the maps seem to have been "lifted" from a copyrighted source. As such, I suspect their appearance is not legal and there will be a fee to pay for such usage. Please be very careful when using products made by other people who are entitled to recoup some of the cost of producing such works. I would recommend the maps are removed immediately before someone (the poster or this forum, perhaps?) gets a hefty bill.

Steve
(WSW)

 

One of the rather modest number of things I like about Americans is their positive attitude and willingness to push ideas to their maximum potential. Shame it's not universal.

The resonance generated there by their President's catchphrase "Yes we can!" is a typical example of this go-getter spirit.
But having admitted publicly that he copied that phrase from his daughter, who "learned it from the TV", shouldn't Obama be paying royalties to the makers of Bob the Builder?

All of the things you mention are issues, but aren't good enough reasons, imho, to cease discussing constructively how to make a convenient reference work for photters, specifically for preserved lines.

For example, I've just been on the OS website and found a no-fee sign-up service called Explore. This allows you to create your own route, and add markers for points of interest and, yes, photos. The result is for sharing with all other Explore members. You're not allowed to use the results for commercial gain, but then that's not under discussion here as an aim, is it? More relevant is clause 7.3 of the terms & conditions, which is about trespass and invasion of privacy.
That means, no close-ups of someone's back garden etc. The railway owner ought to be made to be aware, and accept, that the route alongside their tracks exists in Explore. Will they say yes? Not to do so would be cutting off their nose to spite their face, shirley? Sorry, "surely?"

So that's the copyright issue dealt with. Now Ralph, do you have any suggestions for how to persuade people, who have already been bothered enough to contribute to the various threads here, to let their photos go onto something like OS Explore?

 

Wouldn't Google Maps or MS Live be a better bet? Then everyone could access them without the need to sign up for yet another web site.

 

I like Americans too - but it's interesting to note that the quality, scale, completeness and currency of their mapping is a poor cousin of that produced by the OS. Maybe their map data is "free" because it has no real value at the larger scales.

It's interesting you mention OS Explore. I have a few routes already in place on Explore - search for "Stogumber" or see
http://explore.ordnancesurvey.co.uk/os_routes/show/223
It's a good tool but not well-known. Incidentally, whilst it's OK to link to a route/photospot on the Explore page, you are not permitted to screengrab the mapping and re-issue it, even on a forum like this. You still need a licence to do that. Explore pages can be viewed by anyone, I believe.

Google Maps are freely available but honestly the positional accuracy of the imagery/mapping is really quite poor. For a classic, obvious error that was reported to Google at least two years ago see the two breakwaters at
http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&sou...147682&spn=0.050836,0.219727&t=h&z=13&iwloc=A
There is only one breakwater out there. Free = cheap and nasty. However, Google Maps are great for overviews and small scale navigation, and I use them a great deal. But when you want accuracy, completeness, currency, they are not so hot.

I'm not trying to obstruct constructive discussion here. Indeed, as a lifetime career cartographer, I am delighted that (online) maps can be used for our photography purposes. But we must respect copyright, right?

I look forward to more examples on OS Explore...

Steve
(WSW)

 

Reet lads. Courtesy of the OS Explore website, and thanks to PhotoMatt, Tim Cowen, Beaker and NTDSDN, who all readily agreed to their photos being used, a pilot is now online for a project to assist photters planning to visit preserved railways with which they are unfamiliar. Thanks also to West Somerset Wizard for making me aware of OS Explore. I doubt if I'll be covering the WSR very soon, though, as WSW already has a very superior web page of photting locations.

The example used for the pilot is the Swanage Railway, and the photos are all downloaded from the thread "Swanage Photo Guide" on this forum. There are lots of photoshots that aren't included. That's why it's called "Swanage Railway 1". It is, in fact, a test balloon, which will either fly, or prove to be a bit leaden.

Please take the time to look at the link below, it's better to click on the numbered boxes than on images, so that you can see the commentary first.

http://explore.ordnancesurvey.co.uk/os_ ... show/10486

Minuses:
1. The scale used only goes down to 1:50000, not to 1:25000. But when comparing what I saw on the photos with what I saw on the map, I had little trouble plotting the locations, only occasionally needing support from Google Earth.
2. Once saved, the route is not editable. Version 1 has to be right first time.
3. I'm not happy that I can't control the credit above the photo, so it always says "by tfftff..." but see point 4 under strengths.

Pluses:
1. The online map is just a window onto what nearly all of us have at home, so people planning a visit can easily mark their own OS maps with a location and its approach (often a signposted footpath).
2. Only safe, publicly accessible locations will be cited. The lineside pass will never be mentioned unless a railway contacts me and specifically wants publicity for it.
3. The name of the preserved line will always be in the route title.
4. By using the caption below the photo only to include "Photography by <first name> <surname>", I remain within the terms & conditions of OS Explore. Yet this form of words, when copied, has ensured that all four of my pioneers' websites are reachable on the first page of browser hits (among hits 1-3 using Google).
5. The name "National Preservation" will be read by every visitor to every OS Explore "Photoshots:" route, but it is not the legally responsible originator.


I want to produce these maps above all as a convenience for visitors to the NP forum. I frankly doubt that hundreds of Joe Publics will suddenly flood the linesides because of this; If you disagree, don't assist me. If on the other hand you think this could raise the profile of your local line among our community, or your own as a photographer, let me know by PM.

 

A new good tool. Seems useful