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Project Wareham

Discussion in 'Heritage Railways & Centres in the UK' started by David R, Jul 31, 2015.

  1. 61624

    61624 Part of the furniture

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    The demise of various heritage railways has been predicted for literally decades now - and yet they are still appearing and very very few have disappeared so whilst there may be a gentle weeding out process it is my belief that the strongest ones(and I include the SR amongst them) will survive if they stick to what their core business is : tourism.. Even with the current pressures, people will still want things to fill their leisure time, whether as customers or volunteers and most heritage railways are now significant employers of paid staff. The result of the 90-day trial will be interesting but the evidence from the various lines that have a man line connection is that said connection does not have a major influence on their traffic levels. FWIIW, my view is that the money spent on the DMUs was a waste and that if the reason for providing them was climate change reasons then the reasoning was somewhat spurious! But why do I feel the person I'm responding to has his fingers in his ears and is shouting "LaLaLa !'m not listening!"...?
     
  2. Gladiator 5076

    Gladiator 5076 Part of the furniture

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    Well like a lot of business decisions it will had a business case at the time that was approved.
    Business (and the world) is not static and things change of course.
    On a far more larger scale I am sure the board of Lufthansa when they approved the purchase of 14 A380's (with a probable operating life of 15 to 20 years or longer) they did not expect to have them parked in Spain for the last two years with them never operating for them again or perhaps even being sent for scrap. The first one was delivered in 2010 so at best made half the life expected. Does that mean LH should keep flying them at a loss just because it has them? No of course not like any business it has to change and adapt. Just like the SR and any other Heritage Railway will have to to survive. Especially as it has been announced today that on average it costs a family with two children £400 a month more to live now than it did a year ago. That is a lot of income that is no longer an optional spend.
     
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  3. oliversbest

    oliversbest Member

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    Here is one for you .
    Item 1. as al;ready posted Restore the Rail Link between Swanage and Wareham
    Item 2. as already posted. To run a daily DMU service etc
    If you think those ideas are out of date and overtaken by events. That is your view however more recent events are now overtaking you!
    We even have a contributor saying "Restoring your Railways" initiative is a Tory ploy to gain votes in marginal contituencies!
    At the bottom of the page is written "The Company consider that a restored rail link will benefit the Public by helping to relieve local traffic congestion". And this before the advent of climate change thinking (none of that high falutin public amenity stuff these days especially on here is there?)
    As i said I do think that there are those who will be quite happy to never see a revenue earning service of any kind between Wareham and Swanage.
    nobody has yet answered my question 1)'Why did DCC purchase and refurbish the Class 117 DMUs 2) Why did DCC purchase the trackbed? As a local authority one has to believe it was for a public amenity use
    A contributor gives an analogy of 1850s Canals. Yes they were overtaken and in some cases built on by the Railways
    A more modern scenario. Middle class couple London w/2 children One dog but have made a conscious decision not to own or operate a motor vehicle
    Swanage at one time used to be called "lLondon by the Sea' (due to the number of artifacts shipped from the City to Swanage;so the decision is made
    How do they get there for a holiday with three items of luggage?
    National Express to Bournemouth then the 50 to Swanage. ?Doable but strenuous!
    Train to Wareham. Then its either the 40 Bus. Doable but Strenuous. or a cab(expensive)
    An amenity service could bring them right into the beating heart of Swanage(without being turfed off the train at Corfe Castle!)
    Its a win/win for the environment. SRC. The Main Line Company and Swanage itself
    Let's get those trials underway and let every level of Government and their agencies know what we are doing!
     
  4. Jon Lever

    Jon Lever New Member

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    You are being obtuse (deliberately or not I cannot possibly say); the point is not about the building of (or failure to build) canals in the 19th century. That analogy is just a way of illustrating how the simple passage of time can affect the validity of decisions/pledges made previously. The fact that DCC's decision to invest money in the DMU etc less than 15 years ago could now appear to have been on some level misplaced because of ongoing events just shows the absurdity of blindly clinging to a commitment made over 40 years ago.
     
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  5. 35B

    35B Nat Pres stalwart

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    With whose money?

    No one is disputing that the idea is nice; the question is entirely around the dismal science and practicality. Because, ultimately, I'd far rather have a viable halfway house (as today) than reopen the discussion about how useful Corfe Viaduct would be for the A351 Corfe Castle bypass.

    In terms of your scenario, I suggest your evocation of the joys of Swanage as a destination for that hypothetical middle class family was a bit out of date when EM Forster wrote Howards End*, let alone for such families now. And, assuming it's still true and they don't just fly to their chosen destination, if they don't have a car, they will either hire one or a cab from the mainline station to their accommodation, avoiding the inconvenience of lugging their stuff between trains, or from station to accommodation.

    * - If you don't know the novel, the "younger generation" in the novel visit Aunt Juley near Swanage; this is not considered a particularly exciting stay. My continued inability to persuade my wife or children of the virtues of Dorset suggests the reputation lingers.
     
  6. Woof Mk2

    Woof Mk2 Member

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    What the right Hon Mr Oliverbest forgot to mention was there were 3 routes under discussion debate in the late '70s and early '80s.
    One of them was to use the trackbed, an eastern route with a tunnel through east hill and a route to the west of Corfe Castle.
    From what I recall there was no favourite route out and as the politicians "debated, faffed around and dithered" the railway laid the track and as we approached Corfe we were told that we had to build the railway to what is now Norden as they were concerned, and probably correctly, about parking for those wanting to use the railway along with numerous passengers accessing / egressing the railway into Corfe.
     
  7. DcB

    DcB Well-Known Member

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    Grantham is perhaps a bit of a distance for a day trip to Purbeck. But for those closer a couple of blogs by youngish people.
    https://www.kevmrc.com/corfe-castle-england (although the info on getting there by train is not right)
    https://www.facebook.com/page/1776297562667984/search/?q=swanage wareham link by T. Willis of the Railway Reviewer
     
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  8. twr12

    twr12 Well-Known Member

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    Try this chaps.

    Oliversbest has an opinion. It’s his own opinion, he will never change his opinion. No matter what anyone says to try to change his opinion.

    How about leaving Oliversbest to his opinion?
    And not provoking him to repeat his opinion ad nauseum?
     
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  9. 35B

    35B Nat Pres stalwart

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    My wife's prejudice may possibly be influenced by an undergraduate geology field trip to Kimmeridge Bay, staying in Swanage, in the depths of winter...
     
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  10. Musket The Dog

    Musket The Dog New Member

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    I would say they have more parallels to draw than the railway does to blue streak rockets...

    If the Swanage branch was dormant, this argument wouldn't exist... :Banghead:
     
  11. 007

    007 Member

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    Bloody right. He wants to drag Swanage through the mud for no real reason and people are rising to it. Feeding it like sugar to yeast. Just don't reply to him and focus on the positives of the Swanage Railway Project, what it has achieved, what it will achieve and how it is changing and adapting not only the operation, but its values and aims.
     
  12. 61624

    61624 Part of the furniture

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    Sorry. Point taken!
     
  13. ghost

    ghost Part of the furniture

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    You don't answer questions asked of you, so why should anyone answer yours?
     
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  14. DcB

    DcB Well-Known Member

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    It's not clear from what's been published if Project Wareham goes live in 2023 it will be a Wareham to Corfe or Wareham to Swanage service?
    A Wareham to Corfe shuttle will be lower risk and more practical for SR to run, even though means an extra change to a steam train for passengers.
    If advance notice is given for help, station staff could give assistance.

    Not sure if the DMUs are still being tested Swanage to Frome river bridge or used for training on Fridays?. They may be used for event evening runs in 2022?.

    The refurbished DMUs should now be reliable, I noticed a recovery test with a small shunter loco was done, but the mainline approved Crompton D6515 was not as it was being overhauled, so may need to be done at some point?. Might be used to reduce risk and the insurance cost, which seems to be an important issue as to whether a service will be viable in 2023?.
     
    Last edited: May 24, 2022
  15. Greenway

    Greenway Part of the furniture

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    But people do answer his questions it appears. He certainly has rattled a lot of cadges on this thread.
     
  16. 80104

    80104 Member

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    Well that is a very very interesting statement. If the passenger is travelling on the mainline - which a journey to / from Wareham would entail - then surely SRC as the operator is bound by the ORR requirement for operators to have an Accessible Travel Policy which sets out their arrangements and commitments to support disabled and older passengers in completing their journey by rail.

    Extract from Passengers with disabilities | Office of Rail and Road (orr.gov.uk)

    Passenger Assist

    Passenger Assist is a service provided by train companies to passengers who require help with their train journey. This service has to be booked in advance. From April 2020, the following notice periods will exist across the industry:

    • From 1 April 2020 until 30 March 2021 passengers will be able to book assistance through Passenger Assist until 10pm the day before travel.
    • From 1 April 2021 passengers won’t need to give more than 6 hours’ notice when booking through Passenger Assist.
    • From 1 April 2022, passengers won’t need to give more than 2 hours’ notice when booking through Passenger Assist.
    When booked in advance, assistance should be provided at all stations during the hours in which trains are scheduled to serve the station.

    Staff can help you plan your journey, book tickets and make reservations. They can also assist you at stations and onboard trains, with anything from changing platforms to finding your seat.

    Passenger Assistance is free and available to anyone who needs assistance due to a disability, temporary impairment, or old age. No railcard is required. For more information ask at your local station or visit the website of your local train operator.

    Turn Up and Go

    It’s not always possible to plan your journey in advance. Passengers can turn up at any station that they have identified is accessible to them and request assistance on to a train from a member of staff, or via a help point or a Freephone number. This service is sometimes known as ‘Turn Up And Go’ and depends on conditions at the time of your travel, such as staff availability.
     
  17. 35B

    35B Nat Pres stalwart

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    I think there may be some exemptions under those ORR conditions, which do apply to the mainline TOCs (including Hull Trains, Grand Central and Lumo as open access operators) - it would be interesting, for example, to know whether NYMR are obliged to meet those standards at Grosmont & Whitby.
     
  18. oliversbest

    oliversbest Member

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    Has the SRC issued an updated prospectus since the Project Magna Carta 1981 that i quote(often!!_40 odd years out of date,changing times and circumstances etc, etc.).
    Objective #1 secured
    Objective #2 The DMU service. if that has NOT changed then the Norden Gates faction should bring it to the floor and attempt to make their case official policy!
    meanwhile, summer,very short here north of the 49th is approaching. A planned visit to the UK and Swanage coming up AND i will,health permitting do it again in 2023 to ride from Wareham to Swanage(uninterrupted as I am approaching the disabled bracket)
    on a train. DC and SRC surely will not expect disabled persons to have to change trains(again!) midway as pointed out above!
    Perhaps my children and grandchildren will not get the opportunity to make that journey?
     
  19. oliversbest

    oliversbest Member

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    one could almost guarantee that kicking disabled persons off a service to facilitate the wants of a private preservation Company would not be an exemption
     
  20. oliversbest

    oliversbest Member

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    Talking of molehills I see that The Bluebell is airing its aspirations to reach Ardingly., Some big ones there!
     

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