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Trip Advisor, Customer Service and the future of our railways

Discussion in 'Heritage Railways & Centres in the UK' started by Sidmouth, Jan 3, 2020.

  1. Sidmouth

    Sidmouth Resident of Nat Pres Staff Member Moderator

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    Spurred on by a comment on the WSR operations thread I'd like to educated thoughts of our illustrious members on the direction of railway preservation

    As railways compete for the £££ of Mr and Mrs Joe Public and their children the challenge of offering a value for money, enjoyable day that they want to go back to feels like it is becoming harder . Reading Trip advisor it highlights the expectations people have . Whilst preservation should be about recreating the experience passengers in the 2020's have a reasonable expectation of trains that run to time , good facilities (Toilets etc) , refreshments available , souvenirs and staff that do their best to give good customer service .

    My inclination is there is a perilous balance where the commercial push to earn money, run more trains , drains the goodwill and resources of volunteers who often are volunteering as an escape , past time from their own daily lives . looking forward is the current status quo sustainable ?? I fear probably not which of course means more paid staff and the increased costs that this entails



    Does preservation need to take a step back , almost a little retrenchment to create a stable future
     
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  2. Matt78

    Matt78 Well-Known Member

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    Just a couple of observations from experiences posted on my “home” railway.

    we had an interesting comment a while ago which said that if you go to a preserved railway you almost have to have no expectations to enjoy yourself.. A preserved railway isn’t going to score highly in the pristine cleanliness stakes with working steam, although there is little excuse for dirty toilets and grubby catering outlets.

    Also if you have really good “front of house” staff who are friendly and engage with the public, this is also a big tick in the box and can brighten up the dullest of visits. I took my family to the WHR in May and my daughter was especially appreciative of the buffet car attendant telling the story of Gelert the dog as we passed Beddgelert.

    it seems generally that those visitors that “keep themselves to themselves” and/or have high “service station” standard of cleanliness are inevitably disappointed and post accordingly.Nevertheless a heritage railway’s greatest asset is its people and they can certainly have a big hand in making or breaking a visit.

    regards

    Matt
     
  3. paulhitch

    paulhitch Guest

    Tripadvisor is an amateur, sometimes amateurish, institution. Without spending a fair amount of time investigating the track record (sorry) of individual contributors, it is very difficult to ascertain how much credence to give. How do you compare the point of view of someone who posts multiple reviews of Wetherspoons pubs with another who has the odd visit to Le Gavroche or Claridges?

    However tourist railways should take note of one contributor who said she had been disappointed with such lines as a whole but was delighted to find one where as much care was devoted to the inside of the carriages as the outside of the locomotive.
     
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  4. johnofwessex

    johnofwessex Resident of Nat Pres

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    Pretty much the the point my wife makes, on recent visits the IOWSR & NNR have scored well if not excellently & the WSR much much less so
     
  5. pgbffest

    pgbffest New Member

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    Trip advisor of course is interesting. The angry reports will get written ASAP (sometimes as the day occurs) and often without much thought (especially when the behaviour of the people can be at question!) whilst the good reports can take a day, a week or even longer to come through. Every few years, on the steam side, there is a customer service element to the MIC - how to make people feel welcome or what you can do to assist in that matter. Obviously when things go wrong, then you need to remember not to take the stress out on the travelling public. Ignoring the dirt side of the heritage railway - generally, all you need to do is talk to people to make it a good day (and don't make the price of food too expensive!)
     
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  6. oldmrheath

    oldmrheath Well-Known Member

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    It can be easy to attach too much value to the odd negative review and to deny yourself a decent experience, but I find it a very useful and often accurate resource in helping decide where to stay , eat etc when visiting an area. I sometimes find that recent reviews suggest that things have improved at a destination since my last visit, or that things might have taken a turn for the worse etc. I never look at the track record of individual contributors but tend to take a decent-sized sample of fairly recent reviews.

    Similarly I believe heritage railways should use the feedback, avoiding knee-jerk reactions to perhaps a single negative review but addressing clear issues or patterns of concern . Those I see which have taken the time to respond enthusiastically to positive feedback and sympathetically to negative ones always score points for me on e customer service front,

    Jon
     
  7. Dan Taylor

    Dan Taylor New Member Account Suspended

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    You can't just ignore the bad feedback, everything should be taken on board so you learn from a situation that arose
     
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  8. martin1656

    martin1656 Nat Pres stalwart Friend

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    The problem is this, ask 100 visitors the question " what can we improve on" and you will get 100 different answers, so from my own point of view its cleanliness , coaches that you don't sit down in a cloud of dust, windows that you can actually see out of, lineside cut back so they can see any points of interest, if a Pa is fitted, just use it when needed, for instance when approaching stations, or for pointing out items of interest en route, not to hard sell raffle tickets, or buffet facilities except maybe after station stops, when it is ok to remind passengers that there is a buffet or trolley service. tti's etc can in my book handle raffle tickets guide books etc far better, as part of their duties, or have on train guides etc who chat ,explain places of interest etc, its should be all about ensuring the visitors have a positive experience. stations, need to be welcoming, and that includes the staff, it should be educational , entertaining, period posters, and if you have a siding with wagons, have a notice board near by explaining why local goods traffic was so important for many stations. people these days wont know the impact the railways had on village life.
     
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  9. Sidmouth

    Sidmouth Resident of Nat Pres Staff Member Moderator

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    good points so far , keep them coming . Railways need to get the basics , the core customer needs right . There is a show that is put on that needs to engage the customer

    facebook thread this morning was on WIFI availability in recreating a 60's railway experience . Yes it isn't but 2020's customers having WIFI or good 4G lets them share there enjoyment across social media
     
  10. Big Al

    Big Al Nat Pres stalwart Staff Member Moderator

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    I visited a local heritage railway over Christmas; this included a visit to the gents. It was clean and functional with hot water, a soap dispenser and a warm air hand drier......but it was clearly in heritage style both outside (understandable) and inside.

    If I visit a NT (heritage) property it would not be uncommon to walk into the equivalent facilities and be presented with 21st Century sanitary ware and decor. And that raises the question. Should heritage lines think more carefully about the interface between heritage and contemporary?

    Obviously food standards regulations drive them to pay attention to catering although I can think of when the facilities reminded me more of a transport cafe than anything else. In that respect I have to say that the GWSR is one of the better examples of how to do it. But sometimes the toilet facilities really are an afterthought on railways and no doubt will trigger unfavourable comments on TA. Even NR/TOCs are trying harder on their stations.

    A tricky one, isn't it?
     
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  11. martin1656

    martin1656 Nat Pres stalwart Friend

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    There is no reason other than poor planning, and maybe cost, why any convenience building on any railway need to not look period, except for things such as hand dryers, every modern fitting available is available in a period look such as old brass etc, and tiles are also available in other colours other than white that is one thing that often gets me, Railways go to great lengths to ensure a new building is matched to existing buildings, to not lose the station's look, but then inside its modern, fluorescent lights etc in booking halls, when you can fit a replica looking light but with an LED bulb, its possible to meet public expectations , but also have that historic ambiance that does make people look and think they did a good job here, as regards catering again, whilst the behind the scenes kitchen must comply with modern hygiene requirements, you don't need to serve your customers on paper plates and plastic cups, again classic designs of old railway crockery is readily available , or manufactured to that design if you want your own logo etc, same as you would not use anything other than bone china on your premier dining train, so it should be the same in your refreshment rooms. its all about making an impression giving your customers the wow factor.
     
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  12. MattA

    MattA Member

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    On the subject of toilets: when they're good on heritage railways, they can be very very good - probably the best ones I've ever seen at a tourist attraction were at a steam railway (one in Wales, to be specific)!
     
  13. michaelh

    michaelh Part of the furniture

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    My wife is very much of the view that toilets on heritage railways can be housed in a heritage building - but internally they should be as modern as possible and should offer excellent baby changing facilities.
     
  14. Forestpines

    Forestpines Well-Known Member

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    In my experience the food offering on heritage railways is usually somewhere between "poor" and "very poor" when compared to the food facilities at equivalent locations (I'm thinking of places such as National Trust sites, major museums, Cadw/EH etc). There are a handful that are of average-to-good quality: the Ffestiniog is really the only one that comes to mind easily.
     
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  15. misspentyouth62

    misspentyouth62 Well-Known Member

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    A subject close to my heart. Customer Service should be seen as a differentiator in delivery of a 'product' although I concede that this is made somewhat more difficult in an industry that is heavily resourced from 'hobbiest's" as volunteers and judged on this forum, from a similar perspective.

    For example : Visiting a heritage line on a busy gala event last summer where a loco is failed and timetable is heavily disrupted. I'm very relaxed as I have managed my expectations, am in no hurry and as an enthusiast I have much sympathy with those working their socks off for no recompense to rectify. Family of four on holiday with young children in opposite window are getting agitated at the long wait and lack of information and are starting to discuss asking for compensation. Their perspective is much different to mine and they have spent good money and have decided that their experience is less that satisfactory. We cannot blame said family for not appreciating that their day is being operated by volunteers with ageing trains.

    On the subject of TripAdvisor, it is what it is and is fraught with idiots as well as fraudsters. I would definitely use it however if researching somewhere to stay or eat for instance since I don't find it difficult to see past the 'extremes' in most cases. As a business, to ignore TripAdvisor or complaints from paying customers is a slippery slope to a failing business in my humble opinion.

    I also acknowledge that many hard working volunteers on heritage railways do what they do as part of their hobby and to some, wouldn't life be wonderful without the customer who is always wrong?? :)

    For me I would relish seeing for instance, Heritage railways 'scored' on a number of areas of delivering service across a wide range of 'enthusiasts' distinct from what some may term 'normals' enjoying a day out on their hols perhaps? I also don't think heritage railways can be simply compared like for like because most have something unique to offer and some are in a much better position in terms of geography and foot-fall. I do think that with information that could be gleaned, with the right positive open-minded approach and an instinct for continuous improvement, heritage railways as businesses could and should benefit for knowing what people think about the service(s) they offer across the wide demographic that makes up their customer-base.
     
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  16. misspentyouth62

    misspentyouth62 Well-Known Member

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    Well I would have to agree although I do have low expectations as someone who will endure refreshments in favour for the locomotives I travel to see.
    Today's experience for instance : party of four. Four teas provided via a cold teapot resulted in four cold teas. We laughed but wouldn't have done if we'd spent £7 on cold tea in a tea shop :) Choice of food was very poor so I chose to go without. I'm not complaining though, I didn't expect anything more since I'm a rail enthusiast :)
     
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  17. michaelh

    michaelh Part of the furniture

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    Spooners is excellent we always eat there when staying in Portmadoc. Interestingly though it's not easy to get a decent meal in the evening in Portmadoc - the large numbers of caravan dwellers in the hinterland favour takeaways.
     
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  18. michaelh

    michaelh Part of the furniture

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    Isn't that the problem though, organisations are staffed/managed by enthusiasts who think that this sort of experience is acceptable?
     
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  19. Forestpines

    Forestpines Well-Known Member

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    I'm not entirely sure if the problem is that railway enthusiasts specifically have low expectations and/or standards for food, or that people in general do. I suspect it's the former - and that enthusiast managers simply don't see good food as being a useful thing to offer. I recall on the WSR thread, someone complaining that the WSR doesn't offer any morning hot food options and the response being "well you need to plan your day better" - which is typical for the WSR thread but not really helpful or welcoming.

    As I said though, other sites in the heritage leisure market clearly do value the quality of their food, and it shows
     
  20. ChuffChuff

    ChuffChuff Member

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    So I think you need to understand your target audience(s) and plan accordingly. If you want family return visits, then toilets, warm clean trains, etc. really matter. (Let's face it, Mum makes the decisions!) Enthusiast visits? Probably different goals. Coach parties of retired folk? Different again. Basically, I'm saying you need a visitor strategy, and an understanding of the current visitor demographic (as strategy may not match current) and to take it from there....

    We know before visiting a NT property that the loos will be exemplary, the cafe gorgeous but not cheap, etc. With a new railway you take your chances....

    For what it's worth, my wife will happily return with the family to the IoW and SVR, but is less happy with the WSR purely on the toilets, and that someone was rude to her once....

    By the way, it doesn't matter if the reviews on Trip Advisor are accurate, they set a perception to readers. And people act on their perception, not always reality. So even if you think Trip Advisor is rubbish, you still need to worry about it.
     

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