Vintage Trains 2025

Same. I got to the bit about the train being too much for a jubilee and switched off. Not really sure what people are expecting as the train has to pay its way, and as such needs the coaches it needs to make it pay.

 

But what is there to say really? Without inside knowledge you can't say for sure what the diesel is doing, though you can have an educated guess and maybe talk to the crew. So that leaves how many, three or four unassisted trains this year. Maybe we ought to run a sweepstake so one of us can go and report on a British Pullman run.

 

Nobody forces any one to read posts on this forum if they don't want to - in much the same vain that everyone is entitled to ones own opinion...
The trouble is the criticism of posts is often taken personally - so sometimes maybe things are better off unsaid...

I know which of the two makes for preferred reading (this is after all a forum that is supposed to be about the railtour itself) - and for that I thank 1020 Shireman for his in-depth analysis and write up of the tour that he traveled on.

 

From personal experience I know just what a commitment it is to produce such a detailed report of a trip and am always pleased to read them, with or without a diesel, so thanks from me (but why no mention of a cat?)

In a perfect world all trips would be steam only, this year currently available stock and extreme weather have made such trips almost impossible to find. Previously a regular on WCRC and RTC trips I have decided that mk2s with unreliable air con in hot weather is not for me.

A trip on a Saphos trip to Edinburgh was cancelled, we have booked another for next week but because of the upcoming dry spell I fear that it may be diesel hauled. I’m undecided if I will produce a report, if I do it will not be as comprehensive as Graham’s and it may include mention of a cat, if this offends you then don’t read it.

I would gladly change from my lineside stories (with cat tails) and report on trips behind steam with or without a tail gunner but haven’t travelled on any. Many of us long for a bit of pure steam and mk1s but it is not widely available. I have high hopes for September’s Shap Mountaineer.

 

I get what you say but I do wonder how less than 2 years ago it was apparently economic for RTC/WCRC to run an unassisted Bristol/Par "Duchy" with Bahamas and load 8? Apart from the absence of the Mark 1's and obviously the fire risk I do wonder what has changed.

 

I could be wrong but I think even 2 years ago the Royal Duchy fares were higher fares over the usual fares for other by RTC to make up for the shorter formation, even today the best for standard class is £149 (let’s not even mention how much Flying Scotsman’s Royal Duchy trip cost), I think they did the same with the last time The Welsh Mountaineer ran, cheapest fare was £165 standard class and that was running on a revenue earning 5 coach train

 

In practice yes, there are few mentions in this section of railtours (or light engine or ECS movements) without steam, but those do all belong quite appropriately under the WGO heading if someone cares to post about them. With the combination of WCRC's current choice of coaches and the fire risk I have not yet booked any steam trips this year but I have been on several with diesel power.

 

Could it be that the combination of the two factors you mention plus rising costs/prices and diesel on the back syndrome has caused the market to shrink?

 

My wife and I did only two RTC trips last year and we will do none this year unless things change. We decided to travel only on proper steam tours, that is Mk1s and no diesel. Our next steam trips are with British Pullman and VT. In the future, we might add travelling occasionally on tours hauled by selected vintage diesels, for example a Deltic or the Western. However, our options are likely to be limited by the familiar problems of poor paths and towing an unwanted 47 around.

 

Yes, I think you're correct. I was on what was almost certainly the last Mountaineer in summer 23 - a fantastic trip but must have been a loss-maker as even with only 5 revenue coaches it was by no means full. Very sadly I can't see it running again.

 

It's not just the cost, though that is a massive consideration. It's the length of tours as well. VT aren't too bad for allowing time at a destination (4 hours in Swansea, 3 hours in Newcastle, etc), but others are minimal. There's no way I could persuade my wife and son to do a CME for example. 6 hours each way without a chance to stretch your legs, in a Mk2 that may or may not have working air con, and 90 minutes in Carlisle if it runs to time. If you're in dining at least you can have a bit of a look around. If not, that time soon goes going to get something to eat.

VT's nearest pickup is at least 2 hours away from me, so that instantly adds 5 hours on to the day. RTC and Saphos pick up more locally, but they're very long days with minimal time at destinations.

My wife did a Saphos trip to Bath a couple of Christmases ago which she enjoyed, but four hours each way was at the limit for her tolerance for being on train. Going dining made it bearable, as did the leg stretch at Newbury Racecourse on the outward.

I'm in a similar boat to Martin. We earn decent money, but UK tours are just too expensive for what they offer. For the three of us, a typical RTC tour would be £315 standard class, £610 first class or a whopping £880 dining. There's no way in the world I can justify that sort of expenditure on a day trip. A weekend in Europe including flights, accommodation, travel and a railtour would cost less than that, and the whole thing would be a much more pleasurable experience.