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46233 to York: 10/12/16

Discussie in 'What's Going On' gestart door LMarsh1987, 9 dec 2016.

  1. Dan Hamblin

    Dan Hamblin Part of the furniture

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    Spoke too soon there Peter - 105L at Retford. Wonder what happened between there and Loversall Carr Jn?

    Regards,

    Dan
     
  2. Spamcan81

    Spamcan81 Nat Pres stalwart

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    After recovering to 77 late at Loversall Carr, she's dropped back to 105 down at Retford according to RTT. Let's hope there's scope for recovery in the water stop.
     
  3. buzby2

    buzby2 Well-Known Member

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    Ah well, I suppose it was too good to last.
    As you say, 1Z36 arrived at Retford Platform 1 at 18:29 [105L] - presumably water stop and pathing (but originally scheduled by NR to take 48 minutes).
     
  4. Keith Morris

    Keith Morris New Member

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    Looped for op reasons!
     
    Sheff vindt dit leuk.
  5. Sheff

    Sheff Resident of Nat Pres

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    Where's the A1 when you need one? ;)
     
  6. bgrey62253

    bgrey62253 New Member

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    Inside at ranskill
     
  7. Spamcan81

    Spamcan81 Nat Pres stalwart

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    A quick splash and a dash and she's away from Retford 81 late. Quick work by the support crew there.
     
  8. John Stewart

    John Stewart Part of the furniture

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    We tend to forget that, despite their power, the big Pacifics have less adhesion than a Class 20.
     
  9. buzby2

    buzby2 Well-Known Member

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  10. Spamcan81

    Spamcan81 Nat Pres stalwart

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    67 late at Claypole so clawing back the deficit.
     
  11. Fred Kerr

    Fred Kerr Resident of Nat Pres Friend

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    Not drivel IMHO ! The punters have paid for a day out which has been reduced because certain parties don't want the presence of a diesel at the rear. In the conditions of TDMR (Today's Modern Railway) I consider that diesel on the rear as insurance so if the steam loco has a problem - and the greasy rail on the Hertford Loop seems to have been a problem - the assistance is readily available to reduce delays. I accept that some charter participants may wish not to have this but - accepting that insurance is a cost that one pays to reduce the potential cost should incidents occur - any effort that can reduce costs whilst helping reduce costly delays must surely be the lesser of 2 evils.

    Given the delays incurred by today's charter it would be interesting to know (a) what delays were incurred (b) what was the total cost (c) whose is liable to pay and (d) to whom; it would then be interesting to know (a) what would have been the extra cost of providing a diesel on the rear and (b) what reduction in delay cost would have accrued. Whilst I value steam haulage I also note the rising cost of charter fares; in the last month I have seen the Tin Bath rise from £69:00 in November 2015 to £109:00 in November 2016 and a Southport - Edinburgh charter (dining service) rise from £169:00 to £199:00. I consider that some of that reflects increased costs incurred by charter operators seeking to pass on some of the additional expense caused by charter delays but which can be reduced by the availability rear-end assistance. My fear is that delay costs could reach the point where either Network Rail restricts steam operation to specific routes in specific weather conditions or charter operators elect not to continue main line operation to avoid the increasing level of hasslement that the operation of steam traction on the main line generates.
     
  12. Spamcan81

    Spamcan81 Nat Pres stalwart

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    Are you trying to say that the NP "I don't like boxes on the Back" brigade are responsible for the 47 not assisting northbound today? NR were obviously happy for it to stay behind and you may like to note that it followed 46233 rather than shove it.
     
    stan the man en 60017 vinden dit leuk.
  13. LMarsh1987

    LMarsh1987 Part of the furniture Friend

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    Stormed through a wet Newark station out of nowhere ! I was expecting it a bit later but Luckily I checked RTT in the nick of time and just about got my camera on my tripod.
     
  14. Bulleid Pacific

    Bulleid Pacific Part of the furniture

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    *Speculation alert* I wonder if the shunting from the rear by a diesel had any influence on the buckeye failure? Years of violent movement would probably take its toll eventually. Might also be an issue with HST rakes.

    I've noticed that WCRC are really going for a Pullman makeover. Never seen 'Tanzanite' before Thursday's trip (presumably a new name to follow the precious stone theme), so hopefully more will be repainted over time. Also noticed that they had added a generator car to the consist for ETH. So providing it works (was informed by friends of mine on the tour that it conked out), then a diesel in the consist would be for operational reasons.
     
    Last edited: 10 dec 2016
  15. JDTTRAINS

    JDTTRAINS Member

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    In Peterborough platform 3, arrived 50 down.

    And out, 37 down!
     
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  16. Big Al

    Big Al Nat Pres stalwart Staff Member Moderator

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    Fred. I don't usually take issue with what you say simply because I assume that someone who writes for a heritage magazine seldom talks drivel otherwise they wouldn't last long in print. But that post was drivel.

    The fact that "certain parties don't want the presence of a diesel " had nothing to do with it. West Coast will have decided that the additional cost of sending a diesel plus the associated driver's hours was not necessary. But Network Rail had a problem and tried to keep the network running by sending steam via Hertford North and probably held the charter at Alexandra Park before releasing it up the flyover. The rest we know.

    As for the rising costs of charters. Put that down to the increasing cost of overheads such as decent coal, amongst other things, plus the understandable extra caution on train lengths - guidance that was put together by industry experts who know what they are talking about.
     
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  17. buzby2

    buzby2 Well-Known Member

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    On-the-day specifics -
    If the stock was (allegedly) the wrong way round at Southall then the delayed KX departure would be down to the train operator I suspect.
    Subsequent delay minutes claims would be down to NR - OHLE wires down around Stevenage area I've heard.
    Apparently the crew signed the Hertford Loop and, as mentioned above, NR agreed to divert the train to circumvent the problem.
    However, 46233 was unable to master the combined curvature [sharpish 's' bend] and gradient up the the flyover opposite Bounds Green Depot. There are some interesting aerial shots on: http://www.alamy.com/stock-photo/haringey-aerial.html [AWJXJ2 (RM) and AWJXJ8 (RM) show it quite well].
    By the time WCR's diesel arrived, and arrangements made to set-back/pull back to provide a 'shove' the ECML had re-opened so the Duchess set off Down the main as originally scheduled.
    The next ECML delay payments committee meeting will have a fine time negotiating this one I suspect.
     
  18. Big Al

    Big Al Nat Pres stalwart Staff Member Moderator

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    Just for the record. If RTT is to be believed then the Duchess ran from Retford to Peterborough in about even time..and FL down Stoke.
     
  19. Chris_Sav

    Chris_Sav Member

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    Looks like she's been looped for a couple of 125's coming up behind, was doing so well but hope it's not the hour on the schedule!
     
  20. Spamcan81

    Spamcan81 Nat Pres stalwart

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    Opentraintime's "moving map" showed her on the main all the way.
     

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