What-if....?

Although the heritage railway circuit is going strong today, there are many questions regarding rail preservation.
My biggest what-if, for example, is what-if the GCR had been formed before most of the right-of-way leading to Leicester Central had been wiped out? If so, we'd be seeing 70013 leading a rake of MK1's from Loughborough to Leicester Central.
Also, what-if the Barnstaple to Torrington line had been saved as a coastal heritage line?
What are your what-ifs?

 

20 odd miles of the Somerset and Dorset would be my choice.

 

Is it a tram? Is it a Seaside Pier? No.... it's Magnus Volks' "Brighton and Rottingdean Seashore Electric Railway"

 

I believe the GCR could potentially have had this section but they didn't have sufficient money. Somewhere I have got a nice colour booklet the GCR produced when the double track section was completed. It gave the history. When the GCR first started operations for example the double track was still there for the entire line and they did use it briefly running trains side by side, BR would have sold the lot but they wanted so much for the track and the GCR couldn't afford it. In the end they could only afford a single track between Loughborough and Rothley and because they couldn't pay for the other one, BR ripped it up and sold it for scrap which netted them far less than what they were demanding and the part to Belgrave and Birstall was ripped up completely both tracks.
It then of course cost millions and a lot of effort to later to relay it all and the part to Belgrave and Birstall is still single track even now.

Sadly there is probably lots of similar examples around the country were potential groups were only given a very short time to raise massive amounts of money before the scrap men moved in.
I think BR often made it deliberately difficult in many cases, especially in the 1960s/70s. To be honest if it wasn't for the huge efforts of those pioneers there would be a lot less than there is.

Lines that I think it would have been nice if they had saved

Kingsbridge branch line
Peak Rail through Millars Dale and Monsal Dale with a Midland Pullman and some Midland locos to run on it.
Swindon and Cricklade through to Cirencester or Marlborough or both.
Mid Norfolk railway all the way to Wells, (was there as far as Fakenham until about 1980)
North Norfolk to Melton Constable
Severn Valley all the way to Ironbridge

 

All the engines were scrapped at Barry.

Without these all these what.if would have not happened and railways like the Bluebell, Seven Valley, NYMR would had an engine shortage and with some of these lines listed closed after the end of steam there would have been no steam engines to operate them.

 

..... or Drapers at Hull and Hughes -Bolckow at Blyth...

 

Before I was a teenager, there was a poetic lament (IIRC by either the late John Allison or the late Rev Peter Denny) published in 'Railway Modeller' which began:
Engines are rusting to scrap at Barry
I'm rather sorry, aren't you?

Steam was banned from the mainline, LT has just had it's 'last steam' open day at Neasden Depot and the running joke was that the three best know NG lines didn't reach the places in their names (four, if you counted the Whipsnade and Umfolozi Railway!). Those were very dark days indeed.

Were it not for St.Dai of Woodham, I doubt we'd have much SG steam beyond the Bluebell, Dartmouth, Foxfield, IWSR, K&ESR, K&WVR, Lakeside & Haverthwaite, Middleton, NYMR, Severn Valley and South Devon (Dart Valley, as was) and none of these would be anything like what now exists. There'd not be sufficient suitable locos to run much more than a handful of mainline charters either. Definitely no timetabled "Cathedrals" "Jacobite" or Whitby steam services.

Whether 'modern image' could've attracted enough custom to reopen the many lines which followed those pioneers is debatable. Personally, I doubt even the Mid Hants, Swanage and West Somerset would've been considered viable without sometime Barry wrecks to restore. We definitely wouldn't be seeing arguments over chimney stacks at Broadway!

Anyone who knows me well would tell you I'm not a noted optimist, but when I look at what the heritage sector has acheived since Tom Rolt and a handful of friends (all now departed) mulled the fate of the Talyllyn Railway in his canal boat, nearly seven decades ago, it's nothing short of astounding. There's never room for laurel-sitting and serious challenges remain, but the heritage movement of today enjoys a wealth of expertise and funding undreamt of fifty years ago, with no "gift aid", no "Heritage Lottery Fund" and precious few other grants or tax breaks back then. It's one hell of a base from which to take things forward!

Let's take our heritage seriously, let's take operating safe railways seriously, but please....let's not take ourselves too seriously, for that way lies only madness and perpetual disappointment.

 

What if there'd been no Barry and no Dai Woodham? There would be a lot less locos stood around in need of overhaul, for a start. We'd probably have a lot more Austerities and other industrial locos in regular operation. Perhaps more of the Lambton tanks would have survived as prime motive power as they lasted beyond the end of BR steam. People may have looked abroad for motive power, as did the Nene Valley in its earlier days. We may well have had a lot more Danish & Swedish locos running our heritage railways and we might just have repatriated some of those Aussie locos that were still around at the beginning of the seventies.

 

It is always a shame that there weren't more locos bought direct from BR in working condition but then I suppose first there would have been the thought of where to put it and also people don't miss stuff until it's gone. Same with Classic cars you see pictures of cars like E types etc going for scrap that people would love today.

I wonder whether there are aspects of todays life going for scrap that people will miss in future ? Will people think, oh that Ford Focus going for scrap, used to have one of them etc ! I cant see people missing Modern trains, perhaps the HST will be the only one.

 

There's already a thriving computing heritage scene, going by the name of "retrocomputing" and saving hardware from 30-40 years ago.

 

If the GCR had not been closed there would be no need for the white elephant that is HS2.

 

And a lot less expense on widening loading gauges elsewhere to W12! With the introduction of what became 'Freightliner' so soon after the indecent rush to trash the old GC route, that has to be the single biggest b*ll*ck dropped in tbe Beeching era, with the DN&S route to Southampton running it a close 2nd.... and I'm a 'Southern' fan!

 

Yes, but we (I'm active in that) mostly haven't gotten around to building new copies of historically significant machines we've lost.

There a smattering of original early machines saved and in operation (e.g. the Harwell WITCH), and from slightly later there are still some Bendix G-15's knocking around (IIRC one came up on eBay a couple of months back, amazingly enough), but mostly they are all gone. Most new builds tend to be complete new designs, like this and this new relay computers; and there's also someone working on a tube computer, but I can't find their page, alas.

Anyway, sorry for the off-topic, but you touched a topic dear to my heart!

Noel

 

What if.... I had been born 50 years earlier and could have witnessed A4s hammering through Ardler, Eassie and Glamis between Stanley and Kinnaber Junctions on the Strathmore route. I would have loved to witness that.

Alternatively, what if BR had regarded the Tay Bridge and the single line at Usan as too much hassle, so instead had closed the line between Ladybank Junction and Kinnaber Junction via Dundee and routed Aberdeen trains via Bridge of Earn, Perth and the Strathmore route, keeping Perth-Dundee via Glencarse open as a branch?

 

For me, it's undoubtedly what if the Fife Coast Railway (At least between Leven and Crail) had become a preserved railway. If you remember John Cameron acquired Lochty Farm to run No. 9 in 1967, but what if he had decided that year to take a chance and take over part of the FCR instead of Lochty starting at Anstruther and heading towards Leven. Could you imagine today if No.9 and the K4 working over the route today? It is to me the greatest heritage railway that Scotland never had in my opinion, but it does bring up the interesting question of how much would railway preservation in Scotland would've changed if it had started off earlier.

Another interesting one to add is that the SRPS before going to Bo'ness had their hearts set on the Alloa to Dollar line and BR were more than happy to hand it all over in take after it closed in 1973 but it was cancelled when the local council didn't see the potential of a steam railway in the area. A real big shame that as it is a very pretty area to have a tourist line, but bottom line if you had a Fife Coast and Dollar heritage railways established in the 70's, it's all intriguing to think what could've been. In fact I could make a list of a alternate timeline of railway heritage in Scotland alone.

 

If Hurst Green Junction - East Grinstead Low Level had closed instead of Three Bridges - East Grinstead High Level - Ashurst Junction. It would give the Bluebell Railway another 8 miles of running line, and make for a nice view of the heritage trains passing below the mainline station!