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1968 and all that 24 May - 1 June 2008

Discussion in 'National Railway Museum' started by admin, Apr 22, 2008.

  1. Guest

    Guest Part of the furniture Account Suspended

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  2. black5

    black5 Well-Known Member

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    Re: 1968 and all that. York Fest. Your thoughts....

    I don't know what all the complaints are about. 13 steam locos every one of them brought in just for the event on display (with 2 running shuttles). Yes you could see that many on some preserved lines for a similar price, but this showcases them, brings the NRM much needed revenue (although I think it's shop prices cover a lot of that!!!). Shame they didn't change the loco on the shuttle during the day, but 49 has a great bark, and shame that the Well Tank and Super D weren't in steam (weren't there enough crews???). I felt 1 room of sales stands was good enough, with some good stalls in there, although a bigger one could of been better possibly with model railway exhibitions would have made it a better event, shame though that Bxhill could hardly be seen, behind one of the stalls (i was going to saw its easier to get a good view of the middle of box tunnel than of Box Hill, but decided against it - ok i might of used it anyway) but I suppose the space was needed. I thought well worth £11!!!
    Also had a look round the Search Engine which is a credit to the museum!!!
     
  3. beetlejuice

    beetlejuice Well-Known Member

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    I have to say they didn't seem related and I'm glad i got away with paying the concessionary rate but otherwise I acctually enjoyed it! would have been better if more locos were avaible to look at but you can't change that now!

    Shame the minature railway wasn't running but very good to have a few good conversations would various peoples. Especially the A1 group, easily the most friendly bunch there and they will defiently have a new member/volunteer soon! NRM may also have one.....

    One thing that defiently did annoy me though was some of the NRM staff. I was riding around on my bike contemplating wether it was worth it or not and all I got was odd looks. I know not all of the staff are like that but it doesn't half put you off. If someone hadn't let me get in on a student rate i wouldn't have gone!
     
  4. Sheff

    Sheff Resident of Nat Pres

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    Re: 1968 and all that. York Fest. Your thoughts....

    Moved to main thread on NRM
     
  5. Bean-counter

    Bean-counter Part of the furniture

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    I went on Saturday and would have been disappointed had I not been forewarned from the list of exhibits and comments on here. Relations went last weekend and said that they had seen it in about half an hour. I did take a couple of hours, but mainly due to bumping into various friends and chating with them (and being in what looked to be a short queue at the "bar-be-que"!).

    One of those friends said exactly what I had been thinking - where are the Black Fives (or 8Fs)? As I have said earlier on here, I am not old enough to remember 1968 (although I was just born!) but the image to me is of Stanier 5s and 8s in grimy comdition. The only classes that really presented what was running towards the end were the Brit and 9F. Yet there were 3 examples of 8 coupled Edwardian or Victorian locos - all fine machines but all withdrawn before 1968.

    The other problem was the thing that I felt was missing at the Rail 200 event - the displays suggest that railways consist of purely locomotives. My understanding (although railway preservation and media often seems to agree with the NRM) is that the locos were there to pull things containing paying people or goods. In 2004, the excuse could have been that it was the anniversary of rail locomotion, but "1968 and all that" must surely of been a remit that included changes to passenger and goods traffic and how it was carried. There was one brief comment on the notice alongside the DMU about units replacing "draughtly carriages" and there were some modern wagons dumped to the south of the site, but no commentery on them. Indeed, this is where the electric loco which was repainted and hauled from Barrow Hill specially for the event was dumped - no "expalantion" notice or anything. Other than the electric and a Class 14 (good choice there), the whole modern railway aspect consisted purely of what was on site - do a Class 20, 31, 52 and light-weight DMU really tell the story of diesel replacement?

    The notice boards with each exhibit contained some classics - did you know that The Great Marquess was a mainstay of The Jacobite? In conversation with some-one who knows, we decided my guess of 4 such trains worked by 61994 was felt to be excessive. The notices on the diesels worked on the basis by 1968 railways were a thing of the past and BR should have accepted this by not bothering with new much new equipment.

    Overall, one comment was that keeping the cost down had been a key factor in deciding exhibits - presumably this is why two 8 coupled locos made the short trip from Pickering - rather than relevence to the subject. Both the timing and selection did seem to miss an opportunity, and while I hesistate to say the 1968 anniversary should have been celebrated, at least it should be marked in a way that does explain why it happened and mattered. Looks like private heritage railways are going to have to have a stab at doing that.
     
  6. Sheff

    Sheff Resident of Nat Pres

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    Just back from a week in N Yorks. NRM was on the list of must see's, even though we've been there every 5 years or so, the '68 and all that' was a big draw. Got there, and a guy on the door was handing out flyers and pointing the way. No mention of money anywhere though. So after me and Mrs S had pottered round the main halls, we headed for the '68 show. An extra incentive was the chance of smaller queues for food, the main hall facilities being rammed.

    When we saw the price we were gob-smacked. £22 for 2, one of whom couldn't really care less if she saw another engine or not. Just glad we didn't have the kids with us too. Saved our brass and spent it on the NYMR later in the week. I'd have thought a fiver a head was enough.
     
  7. black5

    black5 Well-Known Member

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    I don't know what all the complaints are about. 13 steam locos every one of them brought in just for the event on display (with 2 running shuttles). Yes you could see that many on some preserved lines for a similar price, but this showcases them, brings the NRM much needed revenue (although I think it's shop prices cover a lot of that!!!). Shame they didn't change the loco on the shuttle during the day, but 49 has a great bark, and shame that the Well Tank and Super D weren't in steam (weren't there enough crews???). I felt 1 room of sales stands was good enough, with some good stalls in there, although a bigger one could of been better possibly with model railway exhibitions would have made it a better event, shame though that Bxhill could hardly be seen, behind one of the stalls (i was going to saw its easier to get a good view of the middle of box tunnel than of Box Hill, but decided against it - ok i might of used it anyway) but I suppose the space was needed. I thought well worth £11!!!
    Also had a look round the Search Engine which is a credit to the museum!!!
     
  8. 5596

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    The complaints, feedback, call it what you will, are that this time the NRM completely and utterly missed the target.

    "1968 and All That" was a very specific title

    A display on that theme did NOT call for a yard full of shiny locos, which with one sole exception had no relevance to the events of 1968. To be relevant if it needed a yard full of locos, they needed to dirty unkempt, rods off examples ready to be towed away, candidates for the scrapman, because that was what 1968 was all about - not a marketers fund raiser.

    Lets be honest a few of the Barry Ten might have conveyed more about what has been done than complete pristine examples.

    It also DID call for a social and historical commentary on the final countdown to the 11th August 1968, the closure of the final depots, what happened to the localities, the staff and the traffic, how the events were celebrated - because celebrated they were, in style, and what has followed for the people, the locos and the the nascent preservation world that was struggling to become established at that time when there was simply too much to save and not enough money or people to do it.

    The NRM should have set the bench mark for commemmorating the events of forty years ago and what has happened since, but the opportunity was missed in spades.

    Sorry if this is harsh - but the curators had a chance to shine here - and didn't
     
  9. John Elliot Jnr

    John Elliot Jnr Well-Known Member

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    Did the curators get much of a look in I wonder?
     
  10. Rumpole

    Rumpole Part of the furniture

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    It seems a lot of the difference in opinions is whether you are content to see (and pay for) a display of locos that could in all honesty be brought together at any occasion given the will, or something that accurately represents the historical context and significance of the events of 1968.

    As has been said, '1968 and all that' is a very specific title, and one where it appears the message has been diluted for a number of people by apparently indiscriminate choice of exhibits.
     
  11. 24C

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  12. Guest

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    Nevertheless, I, too, say What a Rip Off !!

    Unfortunately for the NRM, it's a case of "once bitten - twice shy" ... and, as we all know only too well, railway enthusiasts have very long memories!
     
  13. John Elliot Jnr

    John Elliot Jnr Well-Known Member

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    Yes. I'm just very perplexed by all this. There are many people at York who know much more about '1968 and all that' than this show seems to have got across. Where was their input? There was huge potential here for an in-depth, sophisticated, nuanced and fun show, but it appears to have been missed by a mile.
     
  14. black5

    black5 Well-Known Member

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  15. GNRI SLieveGullion71

    GNRI SLieveGullion71 New Member

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    Most of you think steam in the UK finished in 1968, it didn't WT class 4-6-2 tanks soldiered on until they were officially withdrawn in 1971 the last time one was in traffic being 22 October 1970. This made them the last steam locomotives in mainline operation in the British Isles, Córas Iompair Éireann steam in the Republic of Ireland having ended in 1962 and British Railways steam in Great Britain having finished in 1968.
     

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