Discussion in 'Steam Traction' started by Ian White, Oct 31, 2017.
R.I.P. Sir. It was nice reading your posts!
Now I really didn't realise that You felt so strongly about My right to be wrong, and Your right to be right, of course it would be beyond any other railway company to think of such a thing as standardisation, gosh no, that would be unthinkable, and I would imagine that Swindon were constantly dismantling current locomotives in order to build obsolete designs, goes without saying doesn't it? Seriously though HOW can You or any-one else truly believe that converting one class of locomotive to look like another (I've not used the word generic..... oops sorry) is not a compromise? hang whether it's superheated or not it's still, and always will be a compromise. I was about when this project was first mooted and Maindy removed from Barry, and even then I felt that some-one hadn't done their homework, basing it all upon the conversion of St. Martin into a prototype for what became the Hall class, I feel that events of the ensuing 40 years prove Me to be correct, Whether You like it or not Tornado has been built FROM NOTHING in half the time that it has taken to assemble a STANDARD locomotive from STANDARD parts. I will at this juncture point out that very little of the STANDARD parts that Maindy was made up from have remained unaltered in Lady and other STANDARD parts have been made new. As I have said elsewhere I have not judged good/bad or wrong/right or critised the engineering or workmanship, merely stated that by it's very nature, this along with some other so called 'New Builds' are a compromise as they are neither the locomotives that they were built (and survived)as nor are they historically the locomotives that they appear to be.
Clinker, you have been rumbled - You are Paul Hitch and I claim the £50 prize!
No sorry Sir, I'm not, so I claim My £50 refund,
I think we should also consider who is building these locomotives. The aims of the A1 Trust and the GWS aresurely rather different? The GWS exists to document and educate the history of the GWR- in this context 2999 in 4-6-0 and 4-4-2 form demonstrates a chunk of the history of locomotive enigneering for this company that previously did not exist- provided the detail differences between the original are documented and everyone is aware of them, the fact that the lcomotive is not exactly as the original is surely moot? In many ways the swapping and adapting of nominally "standard" parts is also in the spirit of the old GWR. The A1SLT's aim as to build a modern mainline steam locomotive to run in the 21st century railway environment, whilst again keeping to the spirit of the original loco.
Fair comment, except that apart from the superheated boiler there really is very little on 2999 that is different from an original. The GWS went to the trouble of fitting new cylinders with inside steam pipes. They went to the trouble of fitting lever reverse. Those decisions are quite the opposite of clinker's alleged compromises.
I'm glad that was done, my point is still that 2999 are 20163 were built for different reasons, so I am absolutely happy that different engineering solutions were used. Two worthy locos IMHO
Better still a working Dean single
Now to be fair to Paul Hitch, at least with him he's just being a stern pragmatic realist, who just feels we could all do with having our enthusiasm for big chuffers and WIBN projects taken down a peg or two once in a while, and I don't see that as a bad thing.
We all need a reality check once in a while, even if it at times we find it a tad tiresome, and him a bit of a killjoy.
I personally have for the most rather enjoyed our back and forth debates, even if more often then not we don't agree with one another.
At least when having conservation with him, you know what to expect and he's always pretty sensible with his opinions.
Not always... have a look at the 9F thread. I have no objections to someone having differences of opinion with me, but to compare Alcoholism to ‘Big Chufferitus’ and not back down when you know your being bloody silly, is just well... bloody silly.
Enough of the this bickering.
Congrats to the GWS for a remarkable achievement.
Video: Didcot Railway Centre, Saint Class No. 2999 Lady of Legend, 5th April 2019.
.....and another one:
Didcot Railway Centre, Lady of Legend Weekend, Saint Class No. 2999, 6th April 2019.
Saint - turntable 1 by Paul Simpson, on Flickr
Saint and Hall by Paul Simpson, on Flickr
Well as I said before, I don't agree on many things with him... his clear absolute loathing for big chuffers in general is definitely one such thing I don't agree with him on, but I digress.
And indeed would quite agree, I come here to talk about steam engines and related matters alike, not people!
Find steam engines far more simple yet fascinating then people~.
Loving the pics you got here, particularly this one, a nice comparison between the Saint and Hall here.
Like I said before I'm SO looking forward to seeing it stretch it's legs on other heritage railways, a visit to the SVR being definitely high on my anticipation list.
She sounds a bit "industrial" there! I hope the valve timing has been sorted since then.
I think there’s a few of us waiting for Martin to arrange a Charter with the Churchward Toplights at Bewdley,maybe with 2857 passing on a goods working? Wouldn’t it be nice @Paulthehitch
2999 is a superb loco, a fantastic job, and I love it!
Separate names with a comma.