4449 the story

what happened to the Stanier they had as a shop?

 

Do you mean this one http://www.cs.vintagecarriagestrust.org/se/CarriageInfo.asp?Ref=663 They also had this one as well http://www.cs.vintagecarriagestrust.org/se/CarriageInfo.asp?Ref=751 and a six wheeler http://www.cs.vintagecarriagestrust.org/se/CarriageInfo.asp?Ref=767

 

it will be the first one.Thanks

 

Funny how things crop up from years ago! In 1989 I bought two coaches from Knebworth House, an Ironclad BTK and Stanier BTK. Both had previously been at the MHR and I think that the red vehicle shown in RGs photos is my Ironclad, which had been the Chart Leacon breakdown tool & riding van. It had suffered a fire at the MHR, and was repaired by Jack Waldock, who ran the Knebworth railway museum. The other coach was also ex-MHR, an ex-departmental Stanier BTK which I later sold to the EKR, where it remains.
Mention of the Arlesford runaway also stirs memories. I went to Arlesford to inspect a vehicle, an LNER Thompson BZ which I subsequently bought. It was "in the woods" at the Winchester end of the line and behind it was a rather spectacular pile of wrecked wagons, so mangled that it was difficult to tell how many, except by counting the wheelsets!

 

I was one of the contestants in the same You Bet series (but not the same show)
Still have my You Bet winners trophy at home.
My challenge... was about locomotive numbers and where they were preserved.

 

yep, same accident....they were at the stops and the headshunt also contained at least one Mk1 and I think 30499...quite a few vehicles all of which were pushed some distance, as were the buffer stops iirc. the main frames of 4449 were bent into a z shape under the lavatory....

 

Is that the Ironclad 3187 now at Mangapps?

If I recall correctly that coach had the roof missing over the brake end, but 2 compartments partitions with doors and lavatory compartment still in place, I thought it was fantastic coach, it also had the early style 8ft LSWR plate bogies.

Speaking of the Alresford crash I think wrote off Mk1 TSO 4489 -which was used as a museum coach for a while - and Mk1 FK13088, both coaches were later sold on for static uses else ware.

As for Maunsell 4449 I remember it well, each month it looked better and better, I really looked forward to it running behind the N or U that was running in the early 80's . It was such as shame no only because it was such a nice vehicle with lots of original structure intact (corridor connectors, battery boxes, internal partitions etc) but because if that coach (and Bulleid 4211) had been restored and running then maybe the MHR would have had a better attitude towards the more historic rolling stock that was available then.

I was almost as sad when the other very complete (for a ex-departmental) Maunsell coach BCK 6601 was left to decay and eventually scrapped up at Medstead, and then there was the unique short underframed Bulleid brake 2850 that went the same way. Such as waste, but at least the Pullman 'Bertha' and the Bulleid CK 5761 escaped to fight another day elseware along with the 2 LSWR saloons.

All the MHR has left from those days now is the other Ironclad brake 3190 up there on deathrow at Alton, this was the old Swanage loco group sales coach and again this did have a couple of complete(ish) internal compartments and such. How much longer before 3190 is now more?

 

Yes, it's the same one. In '89 we were preparing to open to the public, but then had to bring our plans forward by about a year so as to make our opening weekend coincide with the celebrations marking the centenary of the local lines. We had nothing suitable to use as a shop/cafe and were getting desperate, so when a friend told me that two coaches were available from Knebworth, I snapped them up. 3187 was chosen for use as the shop/cafe, first because it was the more historic and attractive vehicle, second because the door layout was ideal and third, because, unlike the LMS coach, the roof didn't leak! The only downside was that the remaining short section of corridor partition had to go, though it turned out that little of it was original anyway.

It's still doing the same job and although we have looked at the possibility of replacing it with something else and returning it to running order, we have never found anything more suitable. It would be nice to see it in passenger service, but at present it has a purpose and is maintained, so a more active future is always a possibility.

 

I'm glad I only moved to Alresford in 1989, my garden backs on to the headshunt and I don't fancy runaway coaches on my patio! The headshunt is a bit of a wilderness, even though a few of the more recent occupants have gone (eg class 45). I know Colin Chambers recently took great care when using his crane at the bottom of my garden (lifting a few heavy items into one of the containers opposite the Belle siding, especially as the embankment there seems to consist mostly of clinker and ash! I hope that the MHR uses its new(ish) Carriage shop to good use with the Bullieds and other projects, such as the vintage 6 wheelers. Now the Ropley headshunt is a bit clearer, they may even be scope to do a bit of excavation and fit some sort of roof there (I know this has been the subject of previous thread(s) on this forum) to give at least rudimentary cover to some of the more delicate stock.

 

although 2850 was not great, 6601 was a sound coach we thought and I had the idea of taking it on as a project when 4449 was finished. Intransigence amongst certain people over running agreements was the cause of it being stored in Alresford headshunt in the first place. Noone had an agreement in writing and they made sure we didn't get one....

 

Such as shame, imaging the MHR with those coaches today.

 

Yes it's a great shame. It was a very short sighted decision by the mananagement at the time to get rid of these coaches.

At least most of the coaches were not scrapped though, and went on to new homes. 5761 at Swanage and recently restored there. 1323 and 6697 also at Swanage and hopefully to be restored at some point. The LSWR coaches at Pontypool have survived 20 years of Welsh weather, and seem to have had quite a bit of work done on them.

Also great to see that 3187 is being well looked after. When I win the lottery I will be making Mangapps an offer they can't refuse, and it sending it off for contract restoration (along with 3190, 728 and 773).

 

Oh God, not a horse's head in the bed, I hope!

 

I used to sleep in that coach when I worked on the LMS Jinty.
The springs did work very well as the coach started bouncing with the slightest movement.

 

That was probably just Tommo

 

Not 4449 I know but S2850S in better days.

2850 was in much rougher shape when I saw it but I wonder if she were around today in the same poor state if she still would be scrapped.



Picture Source: http://www.wimrail.org.uk/mag/Corkscrew061.pdf

 

she at least had the corridor connection surviviing at one end. Hopefully that got salvaged

 

You may be right there.
Last seen when he was on a day trip from Haverthwaite at York Model Rly show 2 years ago.

 

My gosh, Tommo, that brings back memories... As an innocent young teenager I learned a lot about life from him. Not seen any of the crew for years, I still get news about JG from my parents. Seems like a life time ago now, the Wednesday nights in the William Cobbett in Farnham plotting the next moves.

 

I believe 2850 was stripped for parts by the Swanage railway before being broken up. I would imagine that's where the corridor connection ended up.