If you register, you can do a lot more. And become an active part of our growing community. You'll have access to hidden forums, and enjoy the ability of replying and starting conversations.

6023

Discussion in 'Steam Traction' started by Eightpot, Oct 4, 2011.

  1. Dan Hill

    Dan Hill Part of the furniture

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2008
    Messages:
    2,576
    Likes Received:
    545
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Brick Machine Operator
    Location:
    Haywards Heath
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    Good to see work is progressing on the loco and hope she's back soon. I too hope BR Blue stays.
     
  2. Steamage

    Steamage Part of the furniture

    Joined:
    Sep 14, 2005
    Messages:
    4,736
    Likes Received:
    1,107
    Location:
    Oxford
    Isn't it odd how different people react differently to the same situations? Even before reading the subsequent updates and discussion, my initial reaction to "Great Western's" picture was "Oh good, work is progressing: she's off the jacks. I wonder how much is left to do?"

    To Buseng I'd say that, whilst there are some locos that raise this question (the few hulks still sitting in sidings, awaiting attention), 6023 shows that it really is worth rescuing locos, and keeping the faith. She's a perfect example of what can be achieved by a small group of dedicated and patient engineers. The present set-backs must be so frustrating for them - after 20+ years to be so near, yet still find so much to do.
     
  3. buseng

    buseng Part of the furniture

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2005
    Messages:
    4,799
    Likes Received:
    349
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Retired
    Location:
    Tilehurst, Reading, Berks.
    I didn't say 6023 wasn't worth rescuing/restoring. I know the state it was in with the severed wheelset etc plus the fact it was carted to Didcot as a wagon load of parts from Bristol 20 odd years ago. Even then a lot of parts got lost between leaving Barry & leaving Bristol. I think it looked a shame parked tenderless & chimney covered over by the turntable after what had been achieved with it. I am not getting involved with livery debates or the politics of the boiler/firebox problems.
     
  4. John Petley

    John Petley Part of the furniture

    Joined:
    Oct 8, 2007
    Messages:
    2,849
    Likes Received:
    2,362
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Researcher/writer and composer of classical music
    Location:
    Between LBSCR 221 and LBSCR 227
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    My impression is that although there are plenty of heated debates on this forum, most contributors seem to come into the "forgive and forget" category. There were plenty of sparks flying about the way the (4)6233 livery poll was handled last year and whether some people were trying to skew the result. We now have an engine in steam and there's much anticipation as it returns to the main line again. Acrimony all forgotten. The level of acrimony seems to be higher as far as the 6023 saga is concerend (I speak as an outsider knowing neither the individuals concerned nor the finer points as to how well (or badly) 6023's problems have been tackled.) I just hope that within a few months, all the bad blood will be in the past and this loco will be performing well on our main lines after one of the most challenging Barry restorations to date. I've never travelled behind a "King" yet and hope it won't be too long before 6023 will enable me to rectify this omission.
     
  5. 45407&44871

    45407&44871 Guest

    Latest update on the website:
    'We have made progress on many fronts this weekend, with all the work on the vacuum pump completed, including the lubrication pot; reinstallation of the (now split by a join) cylinder drain cock rod, removal of the tender steam heat pipe for shortening, welding and other work on the short version cab roof, reinstallation of rear sander pipes, cleaning of corrosion off the front coupling & buffers, & much more besides.'

    Seems that we may see it this summer then? :D
    Keep up the great work guys!
    Matt
     
  6. *8A*

    *8A* New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2007
    Messages:
    184
    Likes Received:
    60
    Location:
    Aberystwyth
    Anyone from the 6023 team or Didcot have any news on further progress with repairs?
     
  7. NDTSDN

    NDTSDN Part of the furniture

    Joined:
    Oct 9, 2005
    Messages:
    2,864
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    A, A
    Above was the last update on the 6023 website (14.03.2012)

    News
     
  8. 45407&44871

    45407&44871 Guest

    Someone on the Facebook Group said that all the rest is complete and it's inside the shed waiting for the firebox work to begin, anyone know if this is true?
    Matt
     
  9. Pannier Man

    Pannier Man Member

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2007
    Messages:
    395
    Likes Received:
    67
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Network Rail - Retired
    Location:
    Reading
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    6023 is currently at the far (north) end of No4 road in the running shed at Didcot.
    (or was on Saturday when I was driving 5322)
    As to when the repairs to the damaged seams starts???
    They still don't talk to the rest of us I'm afraid.
     
  10. buseng

    buseng Part of the furniture

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2005
    Messages:
    4,799
    Likes Received:
    349
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Retired
    Location:
    Tilehurst, Reading, Berks.
    I think it is an utter shame the way this loco has ended up, especially after all the publicity about it's "near impossible" restoration.
    Seems there are far too many squabbles/falling outs/petty arguments - call it what you like - in railway preservation between various groups, people, railways/centres etc.
    Seems more so than in any other "industry".
     
  11. *8A*

    *8A* New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2007
    Messages:
    184
    Likes Received:
    60
    Location:
    Aberystwyth
    Thank you Pannier Man.
    Yes indeed buseng, though I'm sure these things happen just as much in other areas, human nature I'm afraid. Though why hasn't someone senior at Didcot grabbed this one?, 'maybe banged a few heads together' get the whole thing back on 'track' and earn some much needed revenue for 6023 and Didcot.
     
  12. ADB968008

    ADB968008 Guest

    As in real life,you need good management, a clear direction and good leadership to focus on the end goal.
    In preservation the best locomotive restorations seem to be those financed by a private individual, or company, with people contracted to do the work... It's gets done.
    there are well run groups of volunteers where everyone is equal, but the problems start as soon as one thinks they are more equal than others... Soon after the teddies start emerging from the cot. Preservation has as many teddies on the workshop floor as there are dismantled loco parts. It's a health, safety and mental nightmare !
     
  13. std tank

    std tank Part of the furniture

    Joined:
    Sep 20, 2005
    Messages:
    3,808
    Likes Received:
    946
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Retired
    Location:
    Liverpool
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    How right you are.
     
  14. Pannier Man

    Pannier Man Member

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2007
    Messages:
    395
    Likes Received:
    67
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Network Rail - Retired
    Location:
    Reading
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    After the last public slanging in the press from the group, the rest of us have just left them to get on with it. You'll notice there were never any replies to the article. The GWS and the rest of us kept quiet.
    They're so paranoid now, that the fire hole doors are chained and padlocked so none of us know what's happening!
    I only hope they fix the front damper so that it doesn't stay 2" open when you drop the handle, and weld patches over the fire bar carrying bracket holes, or I fear we'll be hearing more reports of leaking seams and tubes the next time she's left to cool down and cold air gets in.
    The offer of help has always been there since last July/Aug, but they want to do it their own way.
    They go up into town for breakfast, not on site with the rest of us, they have tea in their own van.
    Personally, I feel it's such a shame. It's as if 6023 no longer belongs to the GWS.

    Sob story over,... I just hope they can turn it around, but I doubt it'll be this year. I hope I'm wrong.
     
    Great Western likes this.
  15. Skylark

    Skylark New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2011
    Messages:
    2
    Likes Received:
    0
    It is not surprising the 6023 people are keeping a low profile! I had a very long chat with some old friends from Didcot the other day, it seems the group turned down an offer by Pete Gransden to repair the boiler for free, and instead contracted A. N. Other in instead, who was told by the group to replace all the firebox patch screws despite the boiler inspectors report making no mention of such work, and who has done such a poor job at removing Peter’s work that the firebox laps have been condemned and now need replacing, at a cost of many thousands of pounds. One of the experienced people I spoke to thought the cost might be as much as twenty thousand pounds if not more!
    It has been very sad to read all the accusations made by the group. I even hear the ashpan the group made had holes in it but they still blamed someone else for the leaks! Come on boys, this is not the Great Western SOCIETY I remember! Yes we had arguments but we were still all in it together! Didcot would not be what it is today if we had all done our own thing. Pete should have been given the opportunity to mend his work when problems first arose instead of being kept in the dark, perhaps then things would not be where they are now. From what I am told the boiler did not need much work, but now it might not even run this year. Very sad.
     
  16. Skylark

    Skylark New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2011
    Messages:
    2
    Likes Received:
    0
    I should say I don't volunteer at Didcot any more, I did in the late 1970's - early 1980's but still keep in touch with some people. I know everyone is very unhappy about what has happened but they don't want to say anything, like yourself Pannier Man. But I think people need to know. I did not know Pete very well but I think what has happened is very unfair.

    Ray
     
  17. Fat Boy

    Fat Boy New Member Account Suspended

    Joined:
    Sep 2, 2012
    Messages:
    2
    Likes Received:
    1
    Location:
    Sudbury Hill
    I've been a member at Didcot for two decades now, and have worked on both projects and as operating staff. I'm on talking terms with both sides in the 6023 dispute, and for the record Pete Gransden has got me out of a number of engineering fixes over the years (admittedly none of them relating to boiler restoration).

    When the 'dispute' blew up last year there was a members emergency meeting in September at Didcot when KE2 returned to Didcot from its jaunt on the MNR, and the young chap who stood up from the KE2 team was listened to politely and then subjected to an hour of 'we all love Pete' by a vociferous majority.
    It all struck me as an emotional reaction to a perceived unfairness against Pete and equally unfair on the 3 or 4 KE2 blokes who had enough bottle to turn up to face all this (I don't think I would have bothered).
    This wasn't the GWS I recognised, but as far as I could tell, the meeting had been called to show membership support for our Peter, and not to deal with the serious issues brought by the KE2 men. Lots of theories were put up for the problems on the KE2 boiler - ranging from cooling problems, cold air coming in through a damper, rattling track and a load of other stuff, and the blokes from the KE2 team failed to mention that the boiler was already leaking in the patch screwed corners of the firebox before it steamed (which didn't help their cause much). The KE2 men didn't have much evidence at the time, apart from puddles and a wet firebox, but after examination by Pete's chosen expert, it seems certain that the boiler job was not up to standard. An unpopular view at Didcot, but one that needs saying in the interests of justice.

    I went down to the KE2 men when they were on the turntable spur in the spring and one of them has shown me some of the short cuts that appear to have been taken (I can't get into the firebox through the firedoors on account of size and age), but was shown some patch screws where the sacrificial head had been cut through to lower the torque required to wind it in.

    The KE2 men have done a cracking good job on 6023, and have been let down by the boiler restoration - which is the one thing they couldn't do themselves.

    So I reckon the KE2 team have got grounds to complain of their treatment at the hands of the GWS, and it is no surprise that only one of them ever comes to the Wendy House for lunch on a Saturday and the rest now keep themselves to themselves (as Pannier Man has observed), given the demolition job done on them at the emergency meeting after they have given many years of service on one of Didcot's most difficult projects. Just put yourself in their shoes - they can't feel the least bit welcome now.
    The latest I hear on the grapevine is that some graffiti has appeared on KE2 itself in support of Peter Gransden. This must be the last straw for these blokes. I for one am ashamed for what has happened, as should be the rest of the volunteers & management at Didcot.

    Fat (Old) Boy
     
    Great Western likes this.
  18. Jimc

    Jimc Part of the furniture

    Joined:
    Sep 8, 2005
    Messages:
    4,052
    Likes Received:
    4,665
    Occupation:
    Once computers, now part time writer I suppose.
    Location:
    SE England
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    Can anyone think of a situation where finger pointing has ever helped make things better?

    Wise words I saw in connection which quite another area of endeavour was "The only thing you can ever say to a volunteer is thank you".

    Easier said than done of course, especially in situations where there's a need to learn from mistakes.
     
  19. david1984

    david1984 Resident of Nat Pres

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2005
    Messages:
    12,910
    Likes Received:
    1,387
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Birmingham
    Someone please tell me the above is a joke, if someone has sunk so low as to vandalise someone elses preservation project, then they should recieve a lifetime ban from the GWS/Didcot site if/when caught, regardless of whatever has taken place, however controversial, that is unacceptable and that sort of person is most definetly not welcome in preservation.
     
  20. John Petley

    John Petley Part of the furniture

    Joined:
    Oct 8, 2007
    Messages:
    2,849
    Likes Received:
    2,362
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Researcher/writer and composer of classical music
    Location:
    Between LBSCR 221 and LBSCR 227
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    But the saddest thing is that there is no news of an action plan or timescale to see 6023 back in service. I do hope some solution can be found.
     

Share This Page