70013 Oliver Cromwell; Cathedrals Exp; Reading-Canterbury &rtn 28 Sep 2014

RTT shows 1Z84 stopped at Clapham Junction for 30 mins now. Opentraintimes Windsor line signalling diagram shows a 5Z84 heading around the Hounslow loop though. http://www.opentraintimes.com/maps/signalling/WINDSOR

 

Spoke too soon 5z84 just disappeared towards the NLL at Kew Bridge. ECS to Southall I assume.

 

From RTT. <BJ>

''This service was cancelled between Clapham Junction and Reading due to a problem with a steam locomotive''.

 

Ho Hum!

 

Short video and photo from Philpots Lane foot crossing just north of Hildenborough...

https://www.flickr.com/photos/alts1985/15380435951/

 

Not the kind of event that the movement needs, perhaps the more so at present. I commiserate with those responsible for the locomotive but occurrence will be meat and drink for those who wish to rid the network of steam.
The fact that 70013 was given assistance today could mean a number of things, it might have been seen necessary for operational reasons, a problem might have been suspected - though in that case the engine should not have run, or the locomotive was seen as not capable of delivering the performance required.
Well, the train did receive a hearty shove. Understandable. Modern railways require far better acceleration than can be delivered by steam locomotives designed in the middle of the last century. So, get used to it, if operating concern is felt about your ability to keep the network clear you will find that that box will be working hard from time to time. Given the huge disparity between the performance levels of the ancient and the modern we are very fortunate to be allowed on the mainline at all.

 

Well despite what Buseng said I've had 9 steam trips with WCR and not a diesel in sight and only one has been with SD the others RTC, and let's face it without WCR there wouldn't be any steam at all apart from the seasonal couple of months of Torbays, a sprinkling of others and the Belmond which is too expensive for a day out. and as been already said 70013 failed today , so without the box delays could have been a whole lot worse,

 

That's a good manoeuvre............

 

5305 Locomotive Association
11 hours ago
An unfortunate end to the day for 70013, which suffered a lubricator failure this afternoon causing the train to be terminated at Clapham Junction. The has locomotive returned to Southall via Willesden. Word from the crew is that the problem should be able to be repaired presently. We are sorry for any disappointment or inconvenience this incident caused to passengers on The Cathedrals Express.

From the Facebook 5305 page. Great shame as it turned out. She was going so well through Earley this morning (NO the diesel was not 'pushing hard', just ticking over) and seemed to be keeping to schedule until......... Good side is that it appears no service trains were held up, so hopefully no steam reputation damage done. And, incidentally I'm not against diesels on the BACK especially if colour co-ordinated. Plenty of the steam engines are older than me and I need a push quite frequently !!!! Lets hope Olly is back soon....Pete

 

How ironic it is that the last Steam Dreams railtour due to run last Thursday was cancelled because of a diesel failure. I'm sure that Steam Dreams, West Coast and Network Rail would have been rather pleased to have an ancient steam loco from the middle of the last century available at Oxford that day. <BJ>

 

If that is the case, and I do not believe it is, then first generation diesel locomotives designed in the middle of the last century are equally incompetent. It is not the manner of the power generation but how much is available. An important contemporary cause of slow accelerating steam hauled trains is overloading. This could as well be remedied by double headed steam locomotives as a "box on the back"!

 

Not quite so incompetent. They have the advantage of 100% adhesive weight and a higher nominal tractive effort to make use of, two of the great advantages that totally undermined steam as a traction option.
An important cause of slow accelerating steam hauled trains is overloading you write, and that is possibly true on occasion. So how do you avoid the occurrence? You could set fixed load limits. Say, seven for a class 5, eight for a class 6, nine for a class 7 and ten for a class eight with further restrictions on more challenging routes. True ticket prices would increase and some "fanboys" would be apoplectic but NR would probably be far happier and as a bonus you might just not have so many fires upsetting people.
It is a fact that steam locomotives do not create low speed horsepower very effectively (unless you are 160A1) and it is this that is so valuable and it is a further fact that the maximum output of our preserved engines is pretty woeful when compared with the competition that we have to mix with on the national network. Our low maximum permitted speed presents another integration problem never mind the time it takes us to get there and if the rail conditions are not good enough..........
On the other hand, you could get ready to throw in the towel with respect to full access and be satisfied with working on a few prescribed routes where engines getting into difficulties would pose fewer knock on problems.
There is, perhaps, another option but the majority simply won't countenance it.

 

I agree with much of what you write. I should like to see more rigorous load limits and higher maximum speeds allowed. I am not suggesting that locos should be worked excessively but, for example, allowed to run faster downhill when appropriate. I am prepared to pay more for an experience a little closer to the way it (sometimes) was but I appreciate that some are not.

 

67 tons of adhesive weight and 40,000 lbf versus 112 tons of adhesive weight and 55/60,000 lbf. Worse in the case of the 67 tons you have 38.25 tons that do nothing for either traction or adhesion and do not think about the 58 or so tons of the tender. So if you are wanting to start a load and accelerate it away there is only one sensible option.
Until you reach 40 mph or so steam is second best. There comes a point where the steam locomotive starts to gain the upper hand. It starts to be able to produce more horsepower.
So getting to the subject of Shap and Beattock. If you reach the incline at a high enough speed you will have a power advantage, so long as steam and adhesion hold out. For the 47 it cannot match the power output of the Pacific at speeds above, say 45 mph in this instance, and gravity will have it's way. Speed drops until the better part of the power curve is met, you have the adhesion advantage too. The Pacific can be dragged down out of it's zone of advantage and poor adhesion conditions can be so frustrating. You have the capacity to produce more power but the rail conditions make the delivery of the same impossible. So No.9 worked steadily up Beattock at the weekend. In such conditions 112 tons will always be at an advantage.

 

Load of tosh. All the time that heavy freight runs on NR, there will be pathways for steam and diesel charters.
Maybe some specific routes will be almost impossible to path charters on, like WoE line used to be west of Salisbury until the redoubling.