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Buffers of L.M.S. locomotives

Discussion in 'Steam Traction' started by 240P15, Dec 13, 2017.

  1. 240P15

    240P15 Member

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    Hello!:)

    Some of the steam locomotives delivered to the L.M.S. had this characteristic oval- shaped buffers. Was it any particular reason for that, or was it just a sort of "design" especially for some engines?

    Kind regards

    Knut
     
  2. LMS2968

    LMS2968 Well-Known Member

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    Generally it was because the long overhang and consequent high throw-over on tight curves could otherwise lead to buffer locking.
     
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  3. daveannjon

    daveannjon Active Member

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    Interesting that 71000 had them but the Brits didn't, also you'd think if any loco was needing them it was the Thompson pacifics. They do look good though!

    Dave
     
  4. 46223

    46223 Part of the furniture

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    70045 had oval buffers, but I think it was the only Brit to have them.
     
  5. Cartman

    Cartman Active Member

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    Yes it was, understand they were fitted after accident damage repairs. The locos which had them were Duchesses, Princesses, 4MT 2-6-4 tanks, all versions, Fowler, Fairbairn and Stanier, Duke of Gloucester and standard 2-6-4 tanks. Also, some GC locos, ROD 2-8-0s and a few others
     
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  6. Eightpot

    Eightpot Part of the furniture

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    More for show or one-upmanship, I suspect. German locos with as much or more overhang don't need them.
     
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  7. The Saggin' Dragon

    The Saggin' Dragon Nat Pres stalwart Staff Member Moderator Friend

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    Class 40 diesels had them, Classes 44/5/6, with the same bogie design, didn't.
     
  8. Cartman

    Cartman Active Member

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    Yes also the three SR diesels 10201-3 didn't either. 31s, Deltics and the WR Hydraulics also had the oval buffers
     
  9. MellishR

    MellishR Part of the furniture Friend

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    How much wider are oval buffers? Is the difference from round ones more in extra width or in smaller depth?
     
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  10. Muzza

    Muzza New Member

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    What about No. 4 from the Island of Sodor?


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
     
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  11. Forestpines

    Forestpines Active Member

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    I was about to ask, what prototypes (if any) there were for rectangular ones!
     
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  12. class8mikado

    class8mikado Well-Known Member

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    Perhaps they we're pinched off Princess Anne ? , 71000 is technically Longer than a Brit, but the extra length is at the firebox end so it shouldn't throw over any different...
     
  13. Wenlock

    Wenlock Active Member Friend

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    I'm sure I've seen them on modern freight wagons. Obtaining the width required for long wagons with increased end throw, without encroaching on the limited vertical clearances.
     
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  14. Matt37401

    Matt37401 Part of the furniture

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    Have a look at a Class 68's buffers, I'm not sure what shape would describe them!
     
  15. CLN_WVR

    CLN_WVR Member

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    Thank you I have been racking my brains for where I'd seen those buffers (after reading this thread)
     
  16. toplight

    toplight Member

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    I think it was to stop the buffers "locking" ie the buffer on one vehicle going past the one on the next vehicle (on sharp curves) so the two back faces ended up touching. I expect it was to do with length of locos, So for example an LMS Duchess may overhang more on a sharp bend than a shorter engine. The other way would have been to make the buffers themselves a larger diameter. There seems to be a big variation in the diameter of buffers. Wagons for example tend to have much smaller buffer diameters.

    Remember many coaches including Mark 1 also have oval buffers
     
  17. std tank

    std tank Part of the furniture

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    How often have you seen a Duchess pulling a train tender first in BR days? Purely decorative.
     
  18. LMS2968

    LMS2968 Well-Known Member

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    You did see them behind a pilot engine, though. Not often, but it happened.

    6200/01 were completed with round headed buffers, but they were quickly changed for ovals. 6203 also ran for a short while with round buffers before conforming again to the norm.
     
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  19. RLinkinS

    RLinkinS New Member

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    Does the H class on the Bluebell have larger buffers at the rear?
     
  20. 240P15

    240P15 Member

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    Looking at a drawing of the "Duchess Class" (drawn by F.J.Roche), i find that the oval buffers has a width of 24".

    Some of the original G.W.R. engines, "Kings", Castles", Stars" etc) ,seems to have quite small diameter of their buffers. At least compared to those at the class 20 and class 73 Diesels!

    regards

    Knut :)
     

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