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Current and Proposed New-Builds

Discussion in 'Steam Traction' started by aron33, Aug 15, 2017.

  1. S.A.C. Martin

    S.A.C. Martin Part of the furniture

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    I personally think the time is now ripe for the footballer group to "get a grip" in the nicest possible way. They have a reasonable condition B1 tender, this could be fully overhauled and form part of an exhibit to talk on the footballers, and the static B17 could be placed in front of it, under cover and for something specifically creative: STEM events, with the loco able to be opened up or looked at by kids (see the Bluebell Railway's excellent Steamworks exhibits).

    Leaving the B1 tender and the static B17 to sit in a field is not a good long term plan. They need a plan, they need funding, and they need to team up with a - probably LNER biased - railway or museum to suit.

    This is just my two cents - please don't think I am not rooting for everyone in railway preservation to do well. I am. I just think we need a dose of reality at times.
     
  2. Johnb

    Johnb Resident of Nat Pres

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    I think a lot of the new build groups need to be realistic, most will never be built, or at least not in the foreseeable future. The Doncaster P2 group, for example, were on a hiding to nothing from the start. Lots of us wanted to see a P2 built but where would you put your money? Mine, as with most I think, went with the outfit that could say in true Blue Peter fashion, here's one we made earlier.
     
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  3. Cartman

    Cartman Member

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    Agree strongly with the last two posts. I could never see the point of the second B17 project, it seemed to be just a static mock up.
     
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  4. class8mikado

    class8mikado Member

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    Perfect opportunity to have two tenders, one to match with a detachable streamlined casing !
     
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  5. Bikermike

    Bikermike New Member

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    JOOI, is there any update on the Brighton Atlantic, I know they don't set their stall out to provide regular updates, but I feel one of these days we'll get a post saying "oh yeah, we finished it last month".
    The Std 2 Tank has rather gone to sleep as well hasn't it?

    I wonder if CTL Seal could now give a price for a 2nd Clan?
     
  6. class8mikado

    class8mikado Member

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    CTL seal are hosting the Clan project, not doing the design, or management or necessarily all the construction. They are keen to do whatever they feel they can do well however and have excellent heavy engineering facilities, the Clan looks like a Tin toy compared to some of the stuff they make..
     
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  7. Jamessquared

    Jamessquared Nat Pres stalwart

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    There has been the small matter of an epidemic for the last five months ...

    On the Atlantic, current work is focusing on the tender and completing the boiler cladding. There is a bit of logistics to think through at some point in the future with regard how the boiler is fitted - potentially it is cheaper to do in the main workshop with the overhead cranes rather than hiring a crane, but that then means the Atlantic has to dovetail into the main workshop programme. I'm sure there will be an update soon, and I'll update the main thread when there is.

    Not sure what the status of 84030 is, but again, Covid will have prevented on-site work for the last few months.

    Tom
     
  8. Bikermike

    Bikermike New Member

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    sorry, I wasn't meaning to have a dig. I'm certainly not saying they aren't doing anything, just more that they may miss opportunities to keep themselves in the news.
     
  9. Davo

    Davo Member

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    I think as well on the L.M.S. patriot project facebook page it says the pony truck wheels from donor barry 8F have had their axles skimmed and new tyres fitted (i dont know if its on both sets though) and the driving wheel sets have had their keyways machined correctly and refitted at riley and sons engineering and all wheelsets have been returned back to the west sheds at midland railway Butterley, and also a new cylinder drain cock for the middle cylinder has been remade. for more info on this see the L.M.S. patriot project facebook page.
    Davo 56F
     
    Last edited: Sep 1, 2020
  10. Davo

    Davo Member

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    I just wish to correct my prevous post on the L.M.S. Patriot project, Only just reading in steam railway magazine new build news a few days ago the driving wheel set that had its keyways remachined and fitted correctly have been sent from riley and sons to Tyseley to have the axle journals polished.
     
  11. Bikermike

    Bikermike New Member

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    I can't be the only one who wants to see more of the other stuff that occasionally pokes into the edges of the photos from CTL Seal...

    I know that CTL haven't done it all, but they are probably the only commercial organisation who have had enough of the engine through their door to know what it takes. I wonder if they are at the point where a lottery winner could phone them up and ask them for another Clan and just sign the cheque?
     
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  12. ghost

    ghost Part of the furniture

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    With no disrespect intended and I'm sure CTL are very capable, but they're still at the assembly of frames stage. I don't think that is enough to say (at this stage) that they can build an entire loco. You also need to remember that they are building what the Clan group ask them to build and provide the drawings for - CTL are not doing the design/background work.

    Keith
     
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  13. 2392

    2392 Member

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    I'm not sure if one has already been suggested, but, here goes. How about an North Eastern class S/LNER B13 4-6-0, the last one 761 was withdrawn in 1951. It had been withdrawn from public service in September 1934 and transferred to the LNER Research & Development Department as a "counter pressure" engine. An engine that was run in reverse when coupled to another engine running in forward gear in order to provide resistance...... On Nationalisation it was transferred to the Rugby test centre before eventual withdrawal as the last of it's class in service.
     
    Last edited: Sep 8, 2020
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  14. DismalChips

    DismalChips Member

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    To my mind the advantage would be if CTL get a bit of a taste for loco-building, and retain the knowledge and skills to help future groups. Seems a win-win to me, new groups get to work with a company who already know a bit about building engines, and CTL get the work and the publicity. I can't think there's many companies in that line that wouldn't want to be known as having a sideline in building steam engines
     
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  15. Richard Roper

    Richard Roper Member

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    Having recently read about the NER 4-6-0 classes, I gained the impression that they weren't outstanding performers, apart from the B16 variations...
    I gather they rather fell into the category of locomotives that were essentially "enlarged 4-4-0s" which were rather sluggish in service. I guess one would be fine for a preserved line, but for mainline use it may prove rather less than sprightly, which would be an achilles heel as regards impinging on following service trains.

    Richard.
     
  16. Jamessquared

    Jamessquared Nat Pres stalwart

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    What is CTL’s main line of business?

    The difficulty I see of the proposal is that the rate of progress on most new builds is funding-limited, so you potentially have something that is taking up workshop space 100% of the time but maybe only being actively worked on for a small fraction of that.

    Tom
     
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  17. 35B

    35B Resident of Nat Pres

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    I'm not sure I agree. @Jamessquared has commented on the cashflow aspect but, looking up CTL, I suspect they'd want to be careful to draw a line between being supportive of a couple of projects and making it look like a major part of their business.
     
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  18. DismalChips

    DismalChips Member

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    That's a fair point, perhaps why I said sideline. I was thinking more in terms of "a thing we do almost as a hobby" rather than incorporating it into the business. I have no idea what their main business covers, but as I say, the romance that even non-enthusiasts attach to steam trains can only be good publicity. I'm not suggesting they set up as a loco factory, more that it would be beneficial to all for another repository of skills and knowledge to exist.
     
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  19. 35B

    35B Resident of Nat Pres

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    It's worth looking at their website - a rather more extensive portfolio than I'd have anticipated.
     
  20. Bikermike

    Bikermike New Member

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    Impressive stuff!
    https://ctlseal.co.uk/

    they list the clan as one of their featured projects
    https://ctlseal.co.uk/projects/index.html

    I guess it ticks a lot of boxes for them - no secrecy issues (in fact quite the opposite), lots of different complicated stuff in one small space, will be seen in public places when complete, small by their standards

    I rather like this wording "All our four shop floors - Fabrication, Profiling, Machine and Assembly have been a part of this project. The Standard Steam Locomotive team have kindly agreed to give our Apprentices a chance to be associated with this project as part of their training. We are sure this would be a great and inspiring opportunity for our young apprentices."

    There'll be jobs and technologies for the apprentices to learn that are sufficiently well-understood that the apprentices can be let loose in a way that you can't on newer technologies. (my father's car used to get serviced by the apprentices at the local garage as it was that bit older. Only problem was it came back with the valves/points/fuelling etc set up *just so* and it went like a scalded cat for a few weeks afterwards).

    they aren't going to want to fill the place with them, but on the other hand, a job with less time pressures can keep a workforce busy, and hopefully will be something they enjoy doing
     
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