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Do You All Sing from The Same Hymn Sheet

Discussion in 'The Railway Magazine' started by peckett, May 25, 2009.

  1. peckett

    peckett New Member

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    First of all can I congratulate Chris on his campagne to stop enthusiasts and photographers harrased at stations. I think this is mainly due to station staff not reading memo updates and the usual one or two jobsworths that are around.
    Last Sunday I decided to visit the Leighton Buzzard railway and before leaving I thought I would check their website out.
    On the home page I read "the LBR is proud to be a photo friendly location where you are welcome to photo or video without harrasment. All we ask is that you behave safely and reasonably in what is a working railway environment."
    On arrival I had a very enjoyable hour or so at Pages Park watching a TV crew going about its business. After that I made my way to my first photo location. I didn't bother to put on my high vis jacket because of what I had read on the website. It wasn't that I couldn't be bothered, I just thought that the railway didn't want people wandering about with orange vests,and anyhow ,light railway rules and reg's were always less stricked than the main lines.
    I joined a group of about eight photographers, four of which were French. I had only been there a minute or so when a man and woman appered with his and hers high vis vests on ,which looked more like straight jackets than something you would wear for a leisure day out. The man announced that we should all leave the line side as none of us were wearing the appropiate jackets. I drew his attention to information on the website that "everybody" was welcome to video and photograph without harrasment ,which he hardly believed. It was obvious that he hadn't read the latest information issued by the LBR,much like national rail companys employes.
    We all took our photo's and went about our different ways. It was later on that by chance I stood next to one of the photographers who had been at the previous location mentioned. He said that he knew the man who wanted to move us on before.It turned out that he was one of the editors to your magazine,although the name escaped him.
    I would have thought that any employee of the Railway Magazine would keep a very low profile in such cases, unless of course it was a dangerous situation when I would also have intervened myself.
     
  2. 60017

    60017 Part of the furniture Friend

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    From what I can see, you didn't comply with the website's request (on your own admission), so HOW can you justify pointing the finger at an unamed person ALLEGEDLY (through hearsay) employed by RM?
     
  3. Sidmouth

    Sidmouth Part of the furniture Staff Member Moderator

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    Firstly it's a bit underhand having a pop without the courtesy of who you are !

    Having witnessed a couple of instances of people being asked move it is perhaps fair to put an "independent" view

    People seemed to be of the opinion that they could wonder wherever they wanted and without asking proceded to cross the yard where there were loco movements taking place . ther was also an ITV film crew in attendance and the assembled gallery (behind the fence) were asked to move

    I asked myself to access the and and infairness was greeted with a great deal of courtesy and told that with a vis vest it would be no problem. They also allowed many in attendance to cross the tracks for the first departure which was actually quite refreshing , although the wider shot from the safe position I couldn't help but feel was actually better .

    two gentlemen also proceded to leg it up the track

    Now with all of this and people wondering about without asking can you see why requests were made to stay in safe positions ?
     
  4. RM Staff

    RM Staff New Member

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    The gentleman the OP refers to would be Cliff Thomas, section editor of the steam and narrow gauge news sections.

    He is also a director at the Leighton Buzzard Railway....and was there in that capacity, not in any capacity for the magazine. And as such if he felt people were standing in a dangerous position or not complying with fundamentally simple rules, his request to move was reasonable as it was an operational railway. I fail to see why wearing HV is a problem when on or about the track.

    In the meantime our Iron Curtain Britain campaign against the real jobsworths goes on. Read the next column new mag out next week, June 3) and you see it is likely to get worse because of Project Argus.
     
  5. Spamcan81

    Spamcan81 Nat Pres stalwart

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    Without knowing exactly where peckett was standing nor the circumstances surrounding this incident, I can't comment but I can say that I've never been asked to don hi-vis when photographing at the Leighton Buzzard Railway. This includes the area near Pages Park shed, right up to the head shunt, from where many photographers take the standard Pages Park departure shot. I'm wondering if there has been a change of policy in deepest Beds.
     
  6. arthur maunsell

    arthur maunsell New Member

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    taking the world of logistics as a paralell, albeit a loose one, where large heavy vehicles are manoevouring in confined spaces, it is de riguer to wear hi viz.... and daft not to.
     
  7. Threetruckshay

    Threetruckshay New Member

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    Other posts have already made very valid points in response to the disingenuous posting by ‘Peckett’, who chooses to take an anonymous swing at me by misrepresenting what occurred and trying to create a link to quite different issues relating to photography at main line stations etc.

    Let’s get the record straight, he was never, at any point, asked to leave the lineside, neither were any of the others present contrary to his claim.

    When I arrived at the location with the Secretary of GRMT (which owns the loco which was approaching – and she is an LBR member) what actually happened was that I observed that people really should be wearing hi-vis jackets lineside on railway property but I would act as ‘escort’ since they were already there. He replied that the LBR website stated “anyone could go where they wanted” – these were his precise words, witnessed, and he remained adamant on the wording. It is this statement which took me aback – disbelief (justified!) that our webmaster could really have made such a statement (he hadn’t!). What it actually said, which ‘Peckett’ quotes (and thus rather undermines his own argument?) was quite different.

    We were trying to say visitors are welcome to photograph LBR trains because we are very proud of them and do not suffer a misguided delusion that you might be a potential terrorist or whatever - you could say we were all singing from the same hymn sheet! However, if a miniscule minority managed to interpret this as meaning they could do and go where they liked in close proximity to moving locomotives they were pushing it too far. The statement has now been taken off http://www.buzzrail.co.uk.

    As to the location concerned, there should be a complete cattle creep between the track and fences on both sides of the foot crossing between Nelson Road and Vandyke Road plus a notice telling people not to walk by the track. Unfortunately, I discovered it had been vandalised leaving half the creep boards (designed to be difficult to walk over) missing along with the notice. Most people would realise they should not be there - the remaining half cattle creep on one side of the track being a clue!

    These people were in shade under a tree amid undergrowth, trackside without hi-vis clothing, and virtually invisible to loco crews as they approached the foot crossing – naturally the focus of their attention - over the line a few yards beyond where these people were standing. The GRMT Secretary was uncomfortable with the number of people there and decided not to compound the problem, retreating to the public path – joining a photographer who was wearing a hi-vi, even though he did not actually have to!

    Beside the yard at Page’s Park we have erected a fence (and seating) to assist people in safely viewing the trains. Plus, for almost every departure during the two weekends of this event LBR personnel offered to escort photographers to a slightly better position in the yard.

    This was a major event and LBR hoped that large numbers of people would be able to enjoy it – in safety. Unfortunately we encountered problems with people ‘wandering’, causing some concern for our H&S Director, who is now reviewing how this might be addressed.

    Cliff Thomas
     
  8. arthur maunsell

    arthur maunsell New Member

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    i dont sing from the same hymn sheet, but thats because Im the only Chorister in the Village...
     
  9. 60017

    60017 Part of the furniture Friend

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    The fact that this 'person' has never been back to the forum since his/her original post speaks volumes ! Of course, they are probably posting under a completely different name. I sometimes wonder if the 'multiple identity' brigade actually flame and argue with themselves! ](*,)
     
  10. ADB968008

    ADB968008 Member Account Suspended

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    We have a list of "people who talk to themselves", some people post regularly using two id's, which on the face of it is ok, as long as they dont use it to start or provoke a fight, there is one user who submitted one comment and then proceeded to contradict himself and continued to argue with himself ? [-(

    Dont see a double ID for this user, though interestingly every single post is from a different IP address.
     
  11. 60017

    60017 Part of the furniture Friend

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    It doesn't surprise me one bit - but I'll never understand WHY ! LOL
     
  12. simon

    simon Part of the furniture

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    Often so that they can "add weight" to their side of the argument. But given that they seem incapable of changing their writing style it just makes it more fun.

    As has been said above, its even funnier when they argue against themselves.

    I've heard it said that they claim they need a separate id on each computer they use
    ](*,) ](*,)
     
  13. 60017

    60017 Part of the furniture Friend

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    Duh - sign in is the same from any computor if you have ONE i/d !
     
  14. simon

    simon Part of the furniture

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    That's what makes it so amusing as an excuse :)
     
  15. Beaker

    Beaker New Member

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    That takes the fun out creating an argument, and then sending various PMs from one account then denying it from the other, but the real skill is to make a balls up and doing it from the account you are denying it from!
     
  16. ADB968008

    ADB968008 Member Account Suspended

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    There is actually a legitimate claim to using different IDs.

    If you have an opinion about one topic, but your username is affiliated with a group etc who's views may not be the same as your own and you dont want to mis-represent them
    (I can think of a few users who fall into that category and should do this but dont !)

    Or you are employed within the industry and your "work" environment may be able to establish your identity, so having a "work-sensitive ID" and a "less sensitive ID" makes sense, but then you could pick an ID so remote no one will know who you are... unless you log on at work.

    but having two id's sitting in a forum and having a fight with yourself... that would be rather sad, there is actually someone who does this occasionally..we know who "both" of your identities are.

    Occasionally there is a nerd who creates 3 id's, posts from 3 different places and builds his own army of opinion.. but again it's recognisable.

    One thing about the forum is it's public will and sometimes not all the "powers that be" like what they read about themselves...having an ID which is hidden prevents public executions, especially when the executioners sole line of argument is "but your a nobody and i'm a somebody".
     
  17. shredder1

    shredder1 New Member

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    so to sum up, theres only about half a dozen of us on here really :-k
     
  18. simon

    simon Part of the furniture

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    I'm told its far less than half a dozen

    :)
     
  19. richards

    richards Well-Known Member

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    ... and there's actually only one moderator. I've just got a mild personality disorder.

    Yours,

    Richard/Glyn/Ben/Ralph/etc/etc [delete as applicable]
     
  20. ADB968008

    ADB968008 Member Account Suspended

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    What the biggest secret is really theres only one steam engine.. and it gets repainted / rewheeled / resized every weekend.
     

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