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Flying Scotsman

Discussion in 'Steam Traction' started by 73129, Aug 24, 2010.

  1. torgormaig

    torgormaig Part of the furniture Friend

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    Same place as it is now - between the frames, in front of the firebox, which just adds to the difficulty of rakeing out the ashpan. As I recall it is the same on the three A4s (60007/9/19).

    Peter
     
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  2. Miff

    Miff Part of the furniture Friend

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    How can you not love the Porterbrook livery? :) Might look good on FS too, with or without deflectors.
     
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  3. RalphW

    RalphW Nat Pres stalwart Staff Member Administrator Friend

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    Why should our opinion that we are not really concerned about the colour of the 'coat of paint' be rejected?
     
  4. Matt37401

    Matt37401 Nat Pres stalwart

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    Any excuse to show that one again eh @Victor? ;)
     
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  5. Miff

    Miff Part of the furniture Friend

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    I didn’t say it should - please keep saying it if you really must, I asked whether refraining from the debate is not a logical consequence of indifference. It usually works for me.
     
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  6. MellishR

    MellishR Resident of Nat Pres Friend

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    If A prefers BR green, B prefers LNER green and C doesn't care, it is reasonable for all of them to advance arguments in favour of their respective views. If they think of further arguments it is reasonable to add those. It is counter-productive to harp on if you have nothing new to add, but that happens a lot on some threads.
     
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  7. Victor

    Victor Nat Pres stalwart Friend

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    Another ???
    [​IMG]

    Thornycroft 'Trusty' 8 wheeler, I've driven one (long ago), fantastic machine.
    Sorry, it's off topic I know............I'll behave.:D

    FS? I like it as it is now, if pushed I would only change one thing, the chimney.
     
    Last edited: Apr 9, 2022
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  8. Matt37401

    Matt37401 Nat Pres stalwart

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    Wait until you see the Taw Valley video on the SVR thread ;)
     
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  9. Miff

    Miff Part of the furniture Friend

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    Yes but I find it hard to conceive of an argument ‘in favour’ of not caring. Stating you don’t care is merely an unarguable fact. There are many interesting arguments for and against A and B (and for my own alternating A/B position), but if you don’t care you don’t care. That’s fine but there can’t be much to say about it.
     
    Last edited: Apr 9, 2022
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  10. Jimc

    Jimc Part of the furniture

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    So we've gone from arguing about livery to arguing about who's allowed to argue about livery?
     
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  11. Jamessquared

    Jamessquared Nat Pres stalwart

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    Yes, but people like you and me who support the wrong company aren’t allowed to be in the argument about whose allowed to argue about livery …

    Tom
     
  12. Spinner

    Spinner Member

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    Ahh, no. 4472 has a single stage Westinghouse Air Compressor fitted to it for Australia. The air compressor failed on its second last day in service in Australia so it trailed 3642.

    Note in the single picture, there is no water gin.

    Tim Arnot is responsible for the Aylmerton shot, dunno who took the Tullamarine picture.
     

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  13. MuzTrem

    MuzTrem Member

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    FWIW: aesthetically, I much prefer apple green and single chimney. Of course, a part of me is disappointed that we will not see 60103 return to this condition in the foreseeable future. But reading Riley's comments about her current steaming problems in the latest Down Main has changed my mind on the livery issue. We have to accept that the world has changed in the 30 yrs since FS last ran with a single chimney. The coal she was deigned to burn is no longer available. Since she doesn't steam as well on the fuel now available, it clearly doesn't make sense to do anything else that might impair the draughting. If we want our engines to run on the main line, reliable performance has to be prioritised over aesthetics. Whatever else we may decide about livery, the double chimney and deflectors have to stay, for the foreseeable future at least.

    Now if course, the NRM could choose to turn her out in apple green with double chimney again, as she was in the early 2000s. But personally, I take the view that if she must have the blinkers, it's better that she should have the "right" livery to match; not least since she will spend most of her time running with maroon Mk 1s anyway. However, that's a personal view and I respect anyone who disagrees on this point. But I would also point out: when the last overhaul began in the mid-2000s, the NRM initially said they would keep apple green with deflectors - and there were howls of protest. They can't win, whatever they do.

    And finally: I don't know of a single occasion in the last few years when any non-enthusiast has ever complained that they don't recognise Scotsman on account of her livery. She continues to attract vast crowds wherever she goes. So who can blame the Museum for sticking with a status quo which, from their point if view, is working just fine?

    I've done some work with various staff at the NRM over the years and they're good people. They're human, and I'm not saying they get everything right. But I'm sure they would not set out to deliberately mislead people or "pass the buck". Like all museums, they're doing the best they can with limited resources, and trying to satisfy many different groups with competing requirements. I'd just ask everyone to try to have some empathy and cut them a little slack.

    Sent from my SM-A125F using Tapatalk
     
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  14. Sam 60103

    Sam 60103 Member

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    With Steam Dreams being bought by Locomotive Services does this means that most or even all Scotsman tours in the future will be with RTC?
     
  15. Dan Hill

    Dan Hill Part of the furniture

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    I wouldn't necessarily say that. Some sort of dual operating agreement could take place after it's current overhaul, that allows the loco to run trips for LSL/Saphos and RTC. I believe 60007 has an agreement that has LSL provide the bulk of it's mainline work, but is still allowed to haul occasional trips for RTC (happy to be corrected on that).
     
  16. jsm8b

    jsm8b Part of the furniture

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    I'd imagine that is up to the owners (NRM).
     
  17. alexl102

    alexl102 Member

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    Truthfully, I completely understand the arguments both ways. What does baffle me though is that last time I went to the NRM, all their FS merch was based on 4472 in LNER Apple Green. Seems odd to promote the loco in one condition yet run it in a totally different one.
    Anyway FWIW I want to see it in Apple Green with BRITISH RAILWAYS on the tender as E103 or whatever it is!
     
  18. Matt37401

    Matt37401 Nat Pres stalwart

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    FFS, here we go again…
     
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  19. torgormaig

    torgormaig Part of the furniture Friend

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    FFS? Surely you can't mean F*** Flying Scotsman?:)

    Peter
     
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  20. buzby2

    buzby2 Well-Known Member

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