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GCR fails in bid for lottery money

Discussion in 'Heritage Railways & Centres in the UK' started by London Bridge, May 28, 2014.

  1. huochemi

    huochemi Part of the furniture

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    Is it possible for a heritage railway to write a press release without using the word "iconic"?:rolleyes:
     
  2. flying scotsman123

    flying scotsman123 Resident of Nat Pres

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    I understand the need to house everything, if possible in a museum, but I think I'd prefer it to be in as little places as possible, it is a collection after all. I've only been to the nrm once, when I was about 5 I think, I had a roll film camera anyway, and it was amazing the amount of stuff there was, perhaps some of the wonder would be lost if the whole lot was dispersed into several places?
     
  3. Anthony Coulls

    Anthony Coulls Well-Known Member

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    There's more than enough stuff to go around. 292 vehicles in the collection, about 140 at York, 70 at Shildon, and the rest around the country. Everything that was and is planned to go to Leicester North enhances the GC and tells relevant stories. I hope it goes to the second application.
     
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  4. Steve

    Steve Resident of Nat Pres Friend

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    I don't have a problem with the collection being spread far and wide. I also think that it should be kept under cover and on display whenever possible. However, I've never been fond of things simply being stuffed and mounted (I did say 'things') and, whilst i'll be the first to admit that not everything can be operational at once I'd hope that the preferred state was 'in working order'.

    I also wish the idea of museums being children's playgrounds would go out of fashion. There are still a lot more of us old codgers than there are kids and who don't want discovery trails but want good solid learning and knowledge.
     
  5. flaman

    flaman Well-Known Member

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    10 years ago, you could visit York and see the world's finest railway museum collection, all together (well, mostly) in one place. That, to my mind, was what made the NRM special. Today, you will find that many of the jewels in the crown have been hived off to Shildon and various other places, to which we can add "Leicester North", if it ever gets off the ground.

    The final insult? As a result of the dilution and scattering of our national railway collection, the French are now able to claim that Mulhouse is the world's largest railway museum!
     
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  6. Steve

    Steve Resident of Nat Pres Friend

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    In that case, I take my previous post back. Bring everything back to York!
     
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  7. flying scotsman123

    flying scotsman123 Resident of Nat Pres

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    I'm amazed at your shortsightedness, everyone's up in arms about getting the younger generation involved to carry on steam, how on earth is that going to happen if kids are dragged round with large boards full of dense text, that's my memories of museums, discovery trails and the like we're just coming into fashion as I grew too old for them, but I'd have loved something like that. Interactive stuff is brilliant to get young people involved, no one's forcing you to do it too!

    Rant over.
     
  8. The Decapod

    The Decapod New Member

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    Are you sure mean the Great Central, not some other railway? When the two halves of the GCR are rejoined, it will have Nottingham at one end and Leicester at the other, both cities of 300,000 plus population - while Loughborough in the middle has about 60,000.
     
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  9. Steve

    Steve Resident of Nat Pres Friend

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    I'm not short-sighted and i'm not up in arms about getting the younger generation involved because that will happen. I'm not ranting, either. What I am concerned about is the lack of fundamental knowledge being provided and that knowledge base has to be passed on or it will be lost. Knowledge is generally history and that should be a major part of what a museum should do. Explaining how and why is fundamental.

    Interactive is fine, if done sensibly. The NRM used to have such as a piece of track wit various configurations of wheels to show how they stayed on the track and a simple air brake system to explain how it worked. These were aimed at people of all ages, though, and not simply for children. It is the balance that has tipped too far.
     
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  10. daveannjon

    daveannjon Well-Known Member

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    Have to agree, I went to the LT Covent Garden museum and only stayed about an hour, Acton Depot on the other hand kept my interest all day. It's getting the balance right that's crucial, something for everyone, kids, tourists, - and nerds like me!

    Dave
     
  11. flying scotsman123

    flying scotsman123 Resident of Nat Pres

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    Agreed, Steve seemed to be grumbling about children enjoying themselves at a museum last night, on reading it again I was a little quick :oops:
     
  12. 61624

    61624 Part of the furniture

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    Are you sure mean the Great Central, not some other railway? When the two halves of the GCR are rejoined, it will have Nottingham at one end and Leicester at the other, both cities of 300,000 plus population - while Loughborough in the middle has about 60,000.

    They are there already, but do not visit in droves, even though they would only have to drive a few miles. Is there any real evidence that joining the two halves will suddenly make them want to travel? None of these towns/cities is what one might term a tourist hot spot.
     
  13. flying scotsman123

    flying scotsman123 Resident of Nat Pres

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    Although the Great Central Railway is an amzing place, the only double track heritage railway of course, I do agree that it wasn't perhaps situated in the best of places. A better place for double track would be the GWSR :D In all seriousness though, we've got better scenery, and better destinations (or at least we will when we get to Broadway) I'd like to think that one day we could have double track at least on some sections.
     
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  14. Greenway

    Greenway Part of the furniture

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    Visits to the NRM, York, are not a regular thing for me. I live in SW England and so a journey to visit the NRM must be part of a longer visit and a chance to savour the delights of one of Englands oldest, historic, cities. Also most women prefer shops, of which York has some very interesting ones, to museums and that allows for marital harmony.;)

    The large conurbations near the GCR would have little appeal - being large places, so I doubt I would want to visit the line or any NRM exhibits out-stationed there. I am sure that will also apply to many other folks.

    I have the choice to see working railways (some with small exhibits) and some of the frequent visiting working locos in delightful countryside not far from my home. The Paignton - Dartmouth line, with its steam fired paddle steamer and ships, plus the South Devon Railway are not far away. A longer, but not too far trip, takes me to the Bodmin & Wenford in one direction or the West Somerset in another. If double tracks are important then the main line can provide me with that. :)
     
  15. mikechant

    mikechant New Member

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    Personally I only tend to visit heritage railways with a national rail interchange (maybe a short walk involved). The most important aspect of joining the two GCR parts together to me is that the intended interchange station at Loughborough will then give national rail access to both halves of the line.
     
  16. 61624

    61624 Part of the furniture

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    The point I'm making is that being within a large conurbation does not necessarily guarantee success - the market leaders in terms of passenger numbers is the NYMR, which has small towns at each end and small villages between, but they are all touristy destinations, along with much of the country side lying between them, and the journey is a spectacular one, something that the GCR will never be. The possibility of offering higher speed travel is also a red herring, it just makes the journey last less time! Maybe the museum will help to cure that problem, as might Swithland sidings and the Mountsorrel branch if they can be developed to form a sensible part of the experience, but the GCR will have its work cut out attracting locals, particularly at the Leicester end, where there is a high proportion of locals of different ethnic origins with no interest or nostalgia for the steam era.
     
  17. simon

    simon Resident of Nat Pres

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    Last time I went on the GCR there were any number of your "locals of different ethnic origins".
     
    Last edited: May 30, 2014
  18. Neil_Scott

    Neil_Scott Part of the furniture

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    Is it? Nothing I've ever seen makes me think it's better than a host of preserved railways like the SVR, Bluebell, Ffestiniog, Welsh Highland (I'm a member of one, and fire on two of those lines). People seem to pay great homage to the GCR and I don't wish to discredit the work of the volunteers and employees involved in it, but it's not the 'jewel in the crown' of British railway heritage that it gets promoted as. I've found it rather uninteresting (scenery, stations, rolling stock and 'atmosphere' are my criteria) on my visits and the double-track does nothing for me from a purely heritage point-of-view.
     
  19. flying scotsman123

    flying scotsman123 Resident of Nat Pres

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    That's my criteria too, I was simply accepting that a lot of people hold the railway in high esteem, possibly just because it is double track. Out of interest, I wonder how many current heritage railways could in theory be double track?
     
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  20. Jamessquared

    Jamessquared Nat Pres stalwart

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    We did have a thread about double track on heritage lines some years ago.

    Bluebell and GWSR are two that come to mind as having originally been double track and which could legitimately be widened. I believe parts of the WSR were also once double track. However, in general I'm sceptical about the passenger benefit on a heritage line of being able to pass another train at a point other than in a station! I'm sure somewhere or other there might be a line where having a section of double track is commercially viable, but I'm not sure where - perhaps a passing loop away from a station is needed on one or two lines where the stations are inconveniently sited and the traffic demands it.

    Double track adds extra signalling complexity and doubles the amount of p/way materials that have to be bought and regularly inspected, and ultimately replaced. Certainly whenever people have informally speculated about doing it on the Bluebell (most likely the section between Horsted Keynes and West Hoathly), the operational benefits simply don't outweigh the massive cost.

    Tom
     

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