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GCR fails in bid for lottery money

Discussion in 'Heritage Railways & Centres in the UK' started by London Bridge, May 28, 2014.

  1. flying scotsman123

    flying scotsman123 Resident of Nat Pres

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    Exactly :)
     
  2. Greenway

    Greenway Part of the furniture

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    Thank you Anthony. I was unaware of this. One assumes all that one sees in a short visit to a heritage railway is that the railway owns it all.

    My choice, of your three places would of course be Swindon. Rail access and passenger station, not a a limb anywhere and not a heritage railway.

    One can only hope that there is room for more exhibits there and that all the real estate at Swindon has not been asset stripped. ;)
     
  3. Enterprise

    Enterprise Part of the furniture

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    I managed to wander about a considerable number of working sheds without coming to any harm from about the age of 9 upwards. I know many others who also did. As Hartley wrote, " The past is a foreign country etc.".
     
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  4. flying scotsman123

    flying scotsman123 Resident of Nat Pres

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    Yes but I'm guessing you weren't really allowed in there either?

    I know in reality it is NORMALLY perfectly fine for NORMAL people to have a look round, but it only takes one person to trip over something and badly hurt themselves and the railway is in a whole heap of trouble. Health and safety's a bugger, but that's the way it is. As you say, the past's a foreign country.
     
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  5. Peter Hall

    Peter Hall Guest

    It sounds great to have various NRM out stations, but all these have long term financial implications for budgets which will need funding somehow. Just like its great to have new schools and hospitals, the building and equipping is the easy bit, the problem is financing them from then on. Where will the money come from in the future?

    Is the reason why so much former display space at York has been taken over by money making activities that the costs of running the much enlarged publicly accessible site at York and of course Shildon has become a monster that cannot be funded in any other way? Perhaps this is why I also feel that York is less a museum and more of a theme park these days.

    Of course, we might wake up on the 19th September to find that Scottish electorate have come up with an alternative to Leicester for finding space for items from the National Collection. A 'Yes' vote, as I understand it, means a splitting of all UK National Collections and a carting off of what then belongs to Scotland to Scotland.
     
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  6. Sidmouth

    Sidmouth Resident of Nat Pres Staff Member Moderator

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    With outstations the risk is that you dilute the appeal of the main site . People go to see iconic engines , however if they are split across three sites are you really going to all three ? The more the collection is spread the less desire to go

    Both Shildon and York are (and I apologise of Anthony) rather soulless locations . big warehouses with exhibits in . As an enthusiast I go to preserved railways to get my fix of railway atmosphere . Neither location has a big railway context, however the sum of the whole of the collection makes a compelling reason to visit

    Have I been to Boness because 1000 has been there or Barrow Hill because 8217 and 62660 or even Mid Hants with 925 and 850 , the answer to all in sadly not . However if they were all in York or Shildon I would be more minded to go
     
  7. pmh_74

    pmh_74 Well-Known Member

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    Yes, I forgot that Toddington is indeed a nice station. I think my memory of it is clouded by the (more than one) downright rude staff I came across there.

    Now you're just being silly. I didn't say I wanted to "go wandering round". I did however ask very politely if it would be possible to be shown around and effectively got told to sod off. Given that access had been perfectly possible and acceptable on my previous visit, I was somewhat disappointed and indeed surprised. Later that same day, I drove down to the Swindon & Cricklade and even on a non-operating day, the welcome could not have been more markedly different.
    The GCR has had to limit its shed visits in recent years but there are still regular guided tours and a polite request usually meets with a friendly response unless there is some dangerous activity taking place. And yes we do have concrete-sleepered track (though I didn't mention that!), but with possibly one exception we have intentionally kept wooden sleepers through all of the platforms to maintain the atmosphere.

    Ah but it obviously does show, doesn't it, else I wouldn't have noticed. And the two boxes you mention are just abominations that should never have been built on any steam railway. It's all well and good (as someone else has) to say they "could easily be replaced later" but what a monumental waste of effort. I don't buy the idea that there was a "need" to put them in quickly either, other lines have coped perfectly well with much simpler and obviously temporary structures (the one at Kingscote on the Bluebell springs to mind) which don't detract from the atmosphere in anything like the same way.

    You may get the impression that I don't like the GWSR very much - sorry if that is the case - it has the potential to be a very fine railway, but is let down by the details I'm afraid, despite (or perhaps because of) impressive progress in extending the line. But I didn't mean to turn this into a GWSR bashing thread, so lets just leave it there please! I will be back for another visit when you reach Broadway, maybe I'll have a better experience.
     
  8. oddsocks

    oddsocks Well-Known Member

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    I don't think it is generally known that the people restoring 34039 BOSCASTLE at the GCR organise "Shed Tours" on the second weekend of each month. Open to all, the donation box will of course be available.
     
  9. Kinghambranch

    Kinghambranch Well-Known Member

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    "And the two boxes you mention are just abominations that should never have been built on any steam railway."
    pmh_74 Really? You are entitled to your opinion but it isn't mine. They were built like all signal boxes, for a reason! The original CRC signal box was an all wooden structure and was soon demolished after the line ceased to operate stopping trains in BR days. It was usually "locked out" as it was only used on Race Days. If it hadn't been demolished it would have doubtless been torched. The boxes at CRC and Gotherington were built quickly with a steel frame structure to be able to open the line extension signalling asap in 2003. Winchcombe Box came from Hall Green I believe, whilst Toddington's Box is original but the lever frame went to the Gwili Rly just before the GWSR took over occupation in 1980. Broadway Box is of course brand new and is being built on Broadway's Platform 2 using traditional methods and much original box material (the box is to GWR prototype standards but again not the "original" wooden signal box which sat on the south side of the station at Broadway.) I'm sure that both Gotherington and CRC Box will benefit from "GWRification" as time and money permits.

    Much more important is the perception that the GWSR is a location for "downright rude" staff. I'm genuinely very sorry if anyone was rude to you as the GWSR prides itself on being the "Friendly Line in the Cotswolds". I used to show people around the yard back in the late 1980s when I volunteered there and I sincerely hope I wasn't rude to you - it would have done the Railway and me no good! I guess your unfortunate experience was much more recent than that. It's most distressing and I hope that you spoke to one of the GWSR staff about your experience. I am well aware that the shed yard area can now be viewed from the side and plans are afoot for a viewing platform. Security, as opined by FS123, is a problem these days however.

    There is no doubt that, with people like the Broadway Station Building Team and other groups and individuals bringing skills to the Line, attention to detail is beginning to take hold on the GWSR, a line remember that was late into the "Heritage Era" and inherited not a yard of track from BR. It has suffered from 2 horrendous embankment slips so it ain't doing too badly.

    To go back on thread, I do hope that the GCR has another go at the Leicester NRM outstation bid. BTW, how is the "bridging the gap" appeal going?
     
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  10. flying scotsman123

    flying scotsman123 Resident of Nat Pres

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    I'm pretty sure when we discussed this a while ago the 'boxes were found to be be built out of local materials (as the originals were) to a modified GWR design, so not that far off. As Kingham Branch has said, very sorry if you encountered rude staff, but to a certain extent you get those sorts of people everywhere, it can't be helped. Not that I'm making excuses at all for that, there is none, and as mentioned hope you spoke to someone about it. Just saying it's not in any way exclusive, I've encountered people like that on a couple of railways (not the GWSR) When did you first visit th Toddington yard and when did you return out of interest. If memory serves me correctly the robberies were around 2011, so that might have made a difference.

    Dragging this thread back on topic, (perhaps move the GWSR comments into another thread - "GWSR today" for example) I'm coming round to the idea that it might be a good idea to have another outpost for the NRM, but still neutral as to whether it should be at the GCR. I'd quite like one in the South West for example, a trip up to York from Cheltenham is a very long one, one which I've only managed once. I imagine if such events as the great gathering were held again, I'd be much more likely to attend if it was under an hour away than if I had to go up to York or Shildon. Also, people talk about the dilution of a collection, but if there were outstations placed vaguely equidistant around the country and exhibits were rotated regularly, it's free entry so you could just keep going back to your "local" each time new stuff arrives, which isn't really feasable if you live south of the midlands where really you've only got time to visit one once.
     
  11. oddsocks

    oddsocks Well-Known Member

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    Last edited: Jun 3, 2014
  12. Kinghambranch

    Kinghambranch Well-Known Member

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    That's excellent news. I wondered how well it was doing and, by coincidence, the fund has just reached quite a milestone! I know that the GCR is not "there yet" with this project by any means but to think that there were people who doubted that any money would be raised at all. (I was one of them, shows how much I know about railway heritage supporters!)
     
  13. pmh_74

    pmh_74 Well-Known Member

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    A very quick reply to earlier comments re GWSR. I think my first visit was in the early to mid 90s, I visited again in 2006 and I think I've been on another occasion since although probably also in the mid-2000s, but I can't remember exactly when. My experience is certainly not 'current' but I'd say it was relatively recent in the grand scheme of things. (Incidentally, on each occasion 35006 has been "a couple of years" from steaming...!)

    As far as the Leicester North project goes, with my obvious interest in the GCR I do hope that in time we can develop something to make that end of the line more interesting as a destination, though if I suspend my GCR interest for a moment and think about the NRM, I can't help but agree with those who suggest that an outstation in the south-west would be a good idea. I also can't help thinking that the GCR could probably find enough exhibits for a museum of its own, with space available for the NRM and perhaps others, in the style of the SVR's "engine house", so I am not actually sure that filling the proposal only with NRM artifacts is the best thing to do, but presumably that was thought necessary to attract funding. Didn't work, as it turned out, so maybe the re-application will take a different view. Or maybe it won't, I don't know!
     
  14. flying scotsman123

    flying scotsman123 Resident of Nat Pres

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    I know what you mean about 35006, it's been the case that "it will be ready by the end of the ear" for several years now! it does look very very close now, I'm inclined to believe it this year!

    As to your GCR proposal, it sounds good, but as you point out, if it wasn't connected with the NRM, perhaps funding would be even more unlikely to be awarded next time round. Also if it wasn't an NRM outstation it is less likely it would get visits of exhibits from the NRM or hold events like the great gathering. It would then be more of an attraction, so perhaps not as good an idea from the GCR's point of view. However it would mean that if there was to be another RNM outstation it could be more likely to be in the South-west, I'd support one in the south-west very much, based, say, on a railway running through the Cotswolds, perhaps when this certain railway extends to the mainline it could be based at an old MOD yard nearby, if there was such a thing of course...
     
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  15. pmh_74

    pmh_74 Well-Known Member

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    I'd hardly call the Cotswolds the South-West!
     
  16. Jamessquared

    Jamessquared Nat Pres stalwart

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    A bit OT I know, but generally, in Government and related statistics, the South West encompasses Cornwall, Devon, Somerset, Dorset, Wiltshire and Gloucestershire, as well as the unitary councils of Bath and Bristol. So I guess the Cotswolds (in parts) counts as south west!

    Continuing OT: if there was to be an NRM outpost down here, Bristol might be a good shout - well connected not only to Devon and Cornwall, but also London and Birmingham (and points north). It also has other heritage type attractions, so there is a kind of natural synergy or way that you could promote the city as a heritage destination.

    As you were, back to the GCR ... :)

    Tom
     
  17. flying scotsman123

    flying scotsman123 Resident of Nat Pres

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    That's a good idea, like the idea of Bristol. I class us in the south west, Virgin media tv gives us south west news, freeview gives us midlands...
     
  18. ADB968008

    ADB968008 Guest

    Before everyone starts ripping up the plans and starting an "Olympic style" new city bidding process, wouldn't it be worthwhile finding out why the GCR didn't get funding first.

    Railway Preservation has a pretty bad record with lottery cash being lost, wouldn't be surprised if the hobby needed to "extremely" prove itself before recieving funding on a high nature unseen by any previous railway preservation attempt... £10mn was a pretty ambitious amount and isn't handed out on the high st.
     
  19. Anthony Coulls

    Anthony Coulls Well-Known Member

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    On locations of our stuff, there are two locos in Bodmin. The National Collection is all around us, in dozens of different locations if you include artefacts and images as well as rolling stock.

    As for why the GCR didn't get funding, it was up against some other very high profile and high quality projects and there wasn't enough money to go around this time. The very fact that they have been advised to try again should say a lot to the naysayers.
     
  20. 61624

    61624 Part of the furniture

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    Is the original Temple Meads Station used for anything now? This should surely be an excellent candidate for an NRM otstation.
     

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