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Manning Wardles "YEO" and "EXE" new-build

Discussion in 'Narrow Gauge Railways' started by Old Kent Biker, Aug 15, 2018.

  1. Flying Phil

    Flying Phil Well-Known Member

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    It would be good to see the website updated as I'm sure there has been progress since October....
     
  2. Flying Phil

    Flying Phil Well-Known Member

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    Well there have been no updates on the website, so I hope that the wait, for another month, will provide a suitable, pleasant, surprise.
     
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  3. Penrhynfan

    Penrhynfan New Member

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    The Great Western SG 2-6-2 locos were known as "prairies". Was the same term ever used to describe the L&B Manning Wardles?
     
  4. Martin Perry

    Martin Perry Nat Pres stalwart Staff Member Moderator

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    It was a generic term for that wheel arrangement, one amongst many;
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whyte_notation
     
  5. ross

    ross Well-Known Member

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    I believe the first 2-6-2's built in the US were for the CB&Q, a railroad which ran through the plains of Illinois, through Iowa, Nebraska, Wyoming and Montana- The prairie country, hence the nickname. These locomotives were built by Brooks Locomotive Works in 1900, so one of those great American innovations that the Brits had already been doing for some years.
    I believe the term came to these shores in WW1, when the War Department bought 100 rather nifty Alco 2-6-2 tank locos for use on the trench supply railways. These locomotives were found to be rather useful, able to run over the indifferent/poor/lightly laid/damaged track as ably in either direction, unlike the WD supplied 4-6-0's, 75 from Hunslet and 495 by Baldwin which, lacking a rear truck, had to be driven with some caution in reverse. Thus the term "prairie" was adopted as a term of esteem for surefooted and capable engines.
    The L&B M-W's predated those CB&Q locomotives by 3 years, and 20 years before the prairie nickname arrived with the Alco's
     
  6. brmp201

    brmp201 Member

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  7. 30854

    30854 Resident of Nat Pres

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    Good solid progress. Interesting to note same approach to tyres .... or lack of .... taken with Lyn (and 1863 Mountaineer). Of interest, has the recent new build output from North Bay Railway Engineering Services followed this route?

    Question: Are the cylinder castings 'handed' on the MW locos?
     
  8. David Humphreys

    David Humphreys New Member

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    Yes for NBRES on a few of the locos. Blyth has Ringroller Tyres.
     
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  9. fergusmacg

    fergusmacg Resident of Nat Pres

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    Another question - once these wheels have worn out will they then be fitted with tyres - or to put it another way will replacing the wheels entirely be cheaper than going to tyres?
     
  10. Mark Thompson

    Mark Thompson Well-Known Member

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    "...and of course saves the considerable expense of having separate steel tyres cast and machined. That can happen when the wheels have been re-profiled several times and is well into the future. The same logic may apply to the driving wheels on YEO & EXE as tyres are expensive to obtain at the present time."
    So it really is a case of whatever method is cost effective at that unspecified point in the future.
     
  11. 30854

    30854 Resident of Nat Pres

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    Slight difference, you have to suppose, between a Peppercorn A1 'doing the ton' on the mainline and an NG loco poodling around at <25mph. However, I do recall reading the speed limit on the original Southwold was even lower, at 16mph, so wondering why the design of new Blyth specified tyres. I'd emphasise this is literally no more than an idle musing, as it doesn't alter a jot what the marvellous achievement that beautiful little loco is. I wonder what new Gowrie's builders have in mind.?

    One possible contributory factor ..... I daresay we can all recall the problems the Swanage had in procuring tyres for their "mainline" DMUs, not so very long ago.

    Machining to the final profile from castings is usual practice in miniature engineering circles, with any apparent 'tyre' (certainly on 5in gauge locos) no more than the purely decorative product of a spot of lathe work ... usually.
     
  12. Mark Thompson

    Mark Thompson Well-Known Member

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    A major source of locomotive tyres up until now has been from South Africa. I wonder what has closed down this option, whether it be the global hike in the cost of everything, or that the manufacturing capability is no longer available?
    The Patriot project, now that they have to go to the immense bother of having the driving wheels re-cast, are also going to require new tyres, as the originals cannot be re used, so it will be interesting to see how they source theirs.
    O/t, but I truly feel for them. The Unknown Warrior really has turned into The Undiluted Nightmare :(
     
    Last edited: May 4, 2022
  13. Flying Phil

    Flying Phil Well-Known Member

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    It is good to see that a lot of progress has been made on these two "New Builds".
     
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  14. Meiriongwril

    Meiriongwril Member

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    Let's hope they have more than a mile to run on when finished ...
     
  15. Bikermike

    Bikermike Well-Known Member

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    A lot of mainline stock has monobloc wheels now.

    It seems a hostage to fortune to me, if you have a very asymmetrically-curved railway, you could end up with one side needing constant reprofiling and a set of wheelsets down to scrap size rather quickly, even if the overall speed and power suggest not.

    My concern would be over work-hardening of the rim area (either preventing a new running surface being safely formed, creating dissimilar material issues within the casting, or preventing turning off enough to fit a tyre). I doubt there's any other method than trial and error to find out if you've guessed right.
     
  16. ghost

    ghost Part of the furniture

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    I don't think South Africa has ceased to be an option. I read it more as casting the wheel with a 'tyre' in place was cheaper than buying and transporting tyres from SA and then having them machined and fitted. The cost of transport/fuel must surely be a major factor here.
     
  17. 30854

    30854 Resident of Nat Pres

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    That makes me wonder whether modern techniques now mean specific portions of such wheels can be selectively treated (i.e. at the rim/flange and at the boss, where the axle attaches)?
     
  18. Dunfanaghy Road

    Dunfanaghy Road Member

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    Monobloc wheels are, I believe, pressed off their axles and replaced when down to scrapping size.
    Did I imagine it, or is there a source of tyres in Germany?
    Pat
     
  19. Bikermike

    Bikermike Well-Known Member

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    I would guess that Southwold will be a very small operator of locos[1] for some time. The risk of trying new technology for them outweighs any possible gain.
    [1] I know the L&B isn't Crewe, but they have more than one, and a longer line and a bigger active support base.[2]
    [2]which makes Blyth even more impressive
     
  20. Jamessquared

    Jamessquared Nat Pres stalwart

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    Might be wrong, but I also had a feeling that tyres could be sourced from Germany, but only up to a certain size. I think you can get them up to the size of carriage wheels, but not e.g. the larger size needed for most locomotives, for which South Africa was the only supplier. (Accepting that Yeo and Exe have small wheels). Open to correction on that point.

    Tom
     

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