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Manx Northern Railway No 3 Isle of Man Railway No 14 Thornhill and Cleminson Coach

Discussion in 'Narrow Gauge Railways' started by Allan Thomson, Nov 16, 2012.

  1. Allan Thomson

    Allan Thomson New Member

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    After much deliberation I have finally decided I will make these images public due to some recent circumstances.

    A number of images I have shot have just been made public domain on another site by an unknown party. I had not previously made these images public domain as I did not want a flood of requests to see No 14 simply because I (after much negotiation and perseverance, plus some help from a few friends) eventually got to see the loco some years ago. However as these images have just been made public domain on another site (without my consent) I now regard "the cat as out of the bag" and so feel there would be no further 'damage' by sharing them here. I had previously seen on other IMR threads requests for images of 14.

    I am sharing the images, but would appreciate if people would not attempt to contact the owner simply because I eventually got the opportunity to see the locomotive, as I appreciate the time and the hospitality that the owner supplied. It is my hope that perhaps eventually that No 14 might come back into the public domain as part of a museum commemorating the MNR.

    To give a brief history of No3/14 I will use the wikipedia reference:-

    No. 14 (Manx Northern No. 3) Thornhill

    Built: 1880
    Status: Privately Owned

    Built for the Manx Northern Railway in 1880, this locomotive was originally numbered 3, becoming 14 upon the merger with the Isle of Man Railway in 1905 but not receiving its number and chimney numeral immediately. She was the only locomotive purchased by the Manx Northern to be built by Beyer Peacock & Co., in their Gorton Foundry in Manchester (works number 2028), and was similar in design to No. 7 Tynwald. Unique among the fleet in still being in almost "original" form, she retained her distinctive Salter safety valves until withdrawal from service in 1953 and after storage she was repainted and placed on display at St John's station during the 1967 and 1968 seasons, and later at Douglas station. In 1978 she was sold for private preservation on the island and remains there today, unavailable for public viewing.

    I hope you enjoy the images, and I've attempted to provide (as best I could) detailed views of a rarely glimpsed loco. I should give credit for some of the images to my Father Maj TBT (rtd) who shot some.
     

    Attached Files:

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  2. Anthony Coulls

    Anthony Coulls Well-Known Member

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    Re: Manx Northern Railway No 3 Isle of Man Railway No 14 Thornhill and Cleminson Coac

    Wow - another time warp loco. Thanks for sharing these. Never thought I'd see her.
     
  3. Allan Thomson

    Allan Thomson New Member

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    Re: Manx Northern Railway No 3 Isle of Man Railway No 14 Thornhill and Cleminson Coac

    Thankyou, next project the Phyllis Rampton trust......
     
  4. paullad1984

    paullad1984 Member

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    Re: Manx Northern Railway No 3 Isle of Man Railway No 14 Thornhill and Cleminson Coac

    Would be nice to see her run again!
     
  5. Miff

    Miff Part of the furniture Friend

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    Re: Manx Northern Railway No 3 Isle of Man Railway No 14 Thornhill and Cleminson Coac

    Phyllis Rampton?
     
  6. Anthony Coulls

    Anthony Coulls Well-Known Member

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    Re: Manx Northern Railway No 3 Isle of Man Railway No 14 Thornhill and Cleminson Coac

    Let's not go there - and may I respectfully suggest, neither should Allan...?
     
  7. THE MELTER

    THE MELTER Member

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    Re: Manx Northern Railway No 3 Isle of Man Railway No 14 Thornhill and Cleminson Coac

    Can i go please.

    The Melter
     
  8. Dumphrey

    Dumphrey New Member

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    Re: Manx Northern Railway No 3 Isle of Man Railway No 14 Thornhill and Cleminson Coac

    Amen!!
     
  9. 8-10 Brass Cleaner

    8-10 Brass Cleaner Member

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    Re: Manx Northern Railway No 3 Isle of Man Railway No 14 Thornhill and Cleminson Coac

    Lovelly

    Lets just hope that it doesn't get into the clutches of someone who wants to restore it and play trains.

    That should be mothballed just as is. I expect the only loco in unmolested manx condition. I see it has escaped the dulux fad of the 1950's and 1960's too.

    One to put in that shed in York or Shildon I think.
     
  10. Chris B

    Chris B New Member

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    Re: Manx Northern Railway No 3 Isle of Man Railway No 14 Thornhill and Cleminson Coac

    Mona and Douglas are also stored in unrestored condition but not available to view as I believe they are tented up due to them being so original that they are still lagged with asbestos.
     
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  11. marshall5

    marshall5 Well-Known Member

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    Re: Manx Northern Railway No 3 Isle of Man Railway No 14 Thornhill and Cleminson Coac

    Nos 9 (Douglas}and 14(Thornhill) are in the nearest to original condition of all the IMR locos but have been been repainted for display - IIRC No14 in 1968 and No9 in the '70's. No5(Mona) was,I believe,last painted (in Ailsa green) for the re-opening in 1967. I suspect No 14 is also still lagged with asbestos. Hope this helps but I'm sure someone will correct me if I'm wrong. Ray.
     
  12. 242A1

    242A1 Well-Known Member

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    Re: Manx Northern Railway No 3 Isle of Man Railway No 14 Thornhill and Cleminson Coac

    Thank you for posting the links to these. But what would be the best course of action for the future? Decay stands still for no one.
     
  13. marshall5

    marshall5 Well-Known Member

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    Re: Manx Northern Railway No 3 Isle of Man Railway No 14 Thornhill and Cleminson Coac

    As far as I am aware the plan is that IOM Rlys will remove the asbestos from Nos5 and 9 at the same time as 6 and 16 from Port Erin Museum. After that I presume some conservation work will be carried out but I think plans are still fluid. No 14 is of course privately preserved and the owner still intends to restore it to running order.'Hope this answers your question.Ray.
     
  14. david1984

    david1984 Resident of Nat Pres

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    Re: Manx Northern Railway No 3 Isle of Man Railway No 14 Thornhill and Cleminson Coac

    True, but there are photo's of 5 & 9 at the back of Douglas shed a few years ago somewhere on the net if you look for them, I can't recall seeing any photo's of 14 Thornhill post service until now, many thanks for sharing Allan.
     
  15. timmydunn

    timmydunn Member

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  16. marshall5

    marshall5 Well-Known Member

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    Re: Manx Northern Railway No 3 Isle of Man Railway No 14 Thornhill and Cleminson Coac

    Here's a photo of No14 at St.Johns on August 17th 1968 after it was repainted for display. After the Peel line closed it was displayed daily in Douglas for a few years first in the old Peel & Ramsey line platform 57 No 14 and coach bodies at St Johns 17 Aug 1968.jpg and later in the goods yard. In post #1 No14 was said to be have been withdrawn in 1953 whereas it was actually July 1963. Ray.
     
  17. Allan Thomson

    Allan Thomson New Member

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    Re: Manx Northern Railway No 3 Isle of Man Railway No 14 Thornhill and Cleminson Coac


    Is this a troll? I was advised to steer clear of Phyliss Rampton, may I advise you to steer clear of making ill thought out comments like that please.

    It doesn't belong anywhere in York or Shildon. The only place it should stay is on Island, in a place where it has at least got context. You already have two of our loco's in the UK plus a number of our Cleminson's. There's no need for any further items to leave the Island. It is unmolested Manx condition - therefore of most value to those of us on Island. You want to see it or other IMR locos in or out of steam - then come to the Island and see our railways, support them, don't asset strip what has been saved on Island.


    Now lets get on with the thread without igniting any further fighting.
     
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  18. Allan Thomson

    Allan Thomson New Member

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    Re: Manx Northern Railway No 3 Isle of Man Railway No 14 Thornhill and Cleminson Coac

    Thankyou GWR, I hope I've made the right decision and that this won't result in further enquiries from the owner who still largely maintains his position on generally not allowing access.
     
  19. Allan Thomson

    Allan Thomson New Member

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    Re: Manx Northern Railway No 3 Isle of Man Railway No 14 Thornhill and Cleminson Coac

    A fine photo Ray. I've found a few other pictures, but without knowing who is the owner I am reluctant to share them (having been on the other side of someone sharing your pics without asking now), one is a particularily fine Image. I am sure I found it online so a google search will reveal it.
     
  20. Allan Thomson

    Allan Thomson New Member

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    Re: Manx Northern Railway No 3 Isle of Man Railway No 14 Thornhill and Cleminson Coac

    What would I like to see? Well if the owner can be won onside, considering he's got 14 plus the only complete cleminson left on Island, plus other items which might benefit, eventually I would like to see them becoming a nucleus of a museum celebrating mainly the MNR (largely forgotten on Island) in the North of the Island, plus also incorporating the MER artifacts which currently have no safe home. In addition to this it offers a safe home for artifacts felt to have no further use or significance to the railway away from the main site in the South (thereby providing an option to remove items from railway property as requested and providing a new home for them in context)That of course is down to finance, and the personal choice of the owner.

    If as one user has provocatively suggested the NRM should be interested in 'acquiring' some Manx items for its collection (which I believe it doesn't either wish or require to) then it should be providing a safehome to display those artifacts in the place where they have the most context (on Island not away in the North East where most Manx people don't live - I'd be exceptional as could go there whilst staying at my other halfs parents as she's from there). But as I understand the NRM doesn't require any further Manx items (good new to me in the main, like I say items should not be removed from the place they just have context), and its remit wouldn't include setting up a museum site on Island, particularily as there's already one Manx Beyer Peacock 2-4-0T 'preserved' - in the national collection at Manchester).
     

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