If you register, you can do a lot more. And become an active part of our growing community. You'll have access to hidden forums, and enjoy the ability of replying and starting conversations.

MHR Restorations and Overhauls

Discussion in 'Steam Traction' started by LN850, May 21, 2010.

  1. Reading General

    Reading General Part of the furniture

    Joined:
    May 18, 2011
    Messages:
    5,814
    Likes Received:
    1,996
    I suspect they had too much power for the available adhesion.
     
  2. 30854

    30854 Part of the furniture

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2017
    Messages:
    2,456
    Likes Received:
    2,371
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Retired
    Location:
    Brighton&Hove
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    ..... and brakes! Tom's summary a couple of posts back makes perfect sense. They lasted pretty well though, though I'm still a bit surprised the braking issue was never addressed. I was lucky enough to see C1 in harness at the Bluebell during it's time in the south, where it seemed master of all which was asked of it. Love 'em or hate 'em, you can't mistake 'em for anything else this side of Legoland!
     
    Bluenosejohn, gwalkeriow and Wenlock like this.
  3. Wenlock

    Wenlock Active Member Friend

    Joined:
    Oct 26, 2008
    Messages:
    839
    Likes Received:
    272
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Bus Driver
    Location:
    Loughton Essex
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    I suspect that once the wartime emergency was over, the Southern would have been once again running less freight. In order to run freights at speeds to fit between an intensive passenger service either they need more of a fitted head than might be used elsewhere, or the train loads needed to be reduced accordingly. (or perhaps both)

    Given the above it is perhaps no surprise that Southern region was I believe the first part of BR to ban unbraked freights (1980 if my memory serves).
     
    Bluenosejohn and Jamessquared like this.
  4. Jamessquared

    Jamessquared Nat Pres stalwart

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2008
    Messages:
    13,712
    Likes Received:
    15,462
    Location:
    21C102
    I think the key statement is in HAV Bulleid's quote: "So the increasing of the Q1 brake power soon got onto Durban's job list in the Drawing Office; but there were always more important jobs and no loud shouting from Traffic and so it never got done." (my emphasis).

    In other words, the deficiency wasn't so serious given the normal duties, such that for a hard-pressed drawing office other problems got priority.

    Tom
     
    Bluenosejohn likes this.
  5. Bean-counter

    Bean-counter Part of the furniture

    Joined:
    Jul 21, 2007
    Messages:
    4,577
    Likes Received:
    4,478
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Chartered Certified Accountant
    Location:
    North Yorkshire
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    While unfortunately having 'a plan' appears to be all too often seen in this light, it is essential for efficient operation - as they say, 'fail to plan and you plan to fail'!

    Steven
     
    green five and Wenlock like this.
  6. 8126

    8126 Member

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2014
    Messages:
    527
    Likes Received:
    363
    Gender:
    Male
    Or, an old one I seem to be hearing a lot lately: 'Plans are useless. Planning is essential.'

    I know full well that planning is important and I fully expect Ropley and many other locomotive departments have been doing just that for years. But equally, if all you ever say to the public is that the plan is to provide x number of locos in service at any one time, with an average turnover of one overhaul every y years in support of the known service requirements, and that we're currently working on 98606, 98705, 98805 and 98479 (not entirely made up numbers), that's a perfectly reasonable and indeed measurable objective. Nobody can complain when the next to emerge from the works isn't the one they were told it was going to be five years ago...

    So yes, I do think the MHRs willingness to actually set out a more detailed public strategy is going above and beyond what is strictly necessary and therefore commendable. Who knows, it may also help with fundraising a bit...
     
    Bean-counter likes this.
  7. Bean-counter

    Bean-counter Part of the furniture

    Joined:
    Jul 21, 2007
    Messages:
    4,577
    Likes Received:
    4,478
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Chartered Certified Accountant
    Location:
    North Yorkshire
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    Point understood! Yes, useful for fund raising and also openness and definitely commendable! BTW, I have never assumed that the lakc of a published plan doesn't mean the lack of an unpublished one too!

    One advantage of a published plan is that I think it does both focus the mind before publishing and discourage too many changes of plan afterwards - both of which can be good!

    Steven
     
    andrewshimmin likes this.
  8. Romsey

    Romsey Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 14, 2007
    Messages:
    1,444
    Likes Received:
    230
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Retired SPM
    Location:
    Close to Spike Island
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    It's really good to see the MHR being open about the proposed order of work. Plans always evolve, so any organisation needs a starting point to cope with the inevitable changes. Hopefully 98628, 98699 and perhaps 98750 will also fit into the queue at some point.

    Cheers, Neil
     
  9. 30854

    30854 Part of the furniture

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2017
    Messages:
    2,456
    Likes Received:
    2,371
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Retired
    Location:
    Brighton&Hove
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    So we can safely conclude that the Waller's Ash over-run wasn't serious!

    Joking aside, I'd imagine the work around was simply to set load limits the Q1 could stop without any undue dramas.

    It's always struck me as odd that the only place fitted freight stock was routine in these islands was the Irish 3ft gauge, the L&B and L&MVLR .... unless anyone knows of any others. Unfitted freights must have been the bane of many a traffic department!
     
    andrewshimmin likes this.
  10. 73129

    73129 Part of the furniture

    Joined:
    Sep 24, 2007
    Messages:
    4,102
    Likes Received:
    402
    Location:
    Winchester
    Looking forward to seeing 30506 back in steam this year. I wonder if the Autumn gala will be based around 30506 returning to steam. With any luck maybe 30847 from the BB could be one of the visiting locos for the gala.
     
    Hurricane likes this.
  11. Reading General

    Reading General Part of the furniture

    Joined:
    May 18, 2011
    Messages:
    5,814
    Likes Received:
    1,996
    yes I think the railways left it too late to compete with road transport when it boomed. I also think Beeching was too late too, although pruning the branches had already begun before his time.
     
    30854 likes this.
  12. 21B

    21B Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 2, 2009
    Messages:
    1,447
    Likes Received:
    1,327
    The railways were in no position to compete. They suffered from two misfortunes. First they were common carriers and had to accept whatever was offered no matter how uneconomic for them. Second their rates were set by government. They were unable to cut their goods carriage rates to meet the competition from unregulated (largely) truck operators who ran on roads heavily subsidised by the public purse using war surplus (WW1) lorries that were in plentiful supply at peppercorn rates. When one takes into account the natural advantage of the lorry in that it can go door to door it was only the restriction in vehicle weight and speed that lasted well into the 1950s (60s?) that kept so much freight on the railways, that and the fact the railways had to carry even the loss making goods.
     
  13. 21B

    21B Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 2, 2009
    Messages:
    1,447
    Likes Received:
    1,327

    We are in a unique position (for us anyway) that makes publication of a plan desirable:
    1. We have for the first time a number of locomotives that will have to await space in the shed for their next overhaul despite being complete.
    2. We already have several overhauls (35005, 34105, 30850, 30506) and a restoration (75079) underway. We cant do everything all at once so we need to prioritise and drive to completion. Three of the overhauls are time-bound.
    3. We have recently acquired a well-beloved locomotive, and rightly the membership want to understand plans for it.

    When you've answered all the questions, you've provided the plan.

    The plan is of course caveated with "any plan remains under constant review and may change at any time". I think it was Patten who said that it wasnt the plan which was important, but the planning was essential.
     
    cct man, 30854 and Swan Age like this.
  14. 3855

    3855 Member

    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2008
    Messages:
    353
    Likes Received:
    174
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    inside a boiler
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    Do you mean the former governor of Hong Kong Chris Patten?
     
    26D_M likes this.
  15. martin1656

    martin1656 Resident of Nat Pres Friend

    Joined:
    Dec 8, 2014
    Messages:
    8,820
    Likes Received:
    4,876
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    St Leonards
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    Any plan is subject to change, i'm assuming that of those engines listed 30506 , will be outshopped later this year, and 35005 some time next year /2020, with 34105 most likily 2020-2021, thats still some 3 years, of course you have to remember at the same time engines will be coming out of traffic as they reach the end of their boiler certificates , i ideally it needs to be one out, one in, so you have sufficient engines to meet your traffic needs, and then you have to look at what engine needs what, for instance, if you have two engines, one needs less work and can be turned round in 12-18 months, vs one thats going to take 3 years, which do you do? my gut feeling is that if 850 hasnt been started, it may be prudent to look at what engine in the overhaul queue needs what, and then to move engines up the queue , and of course you have to separate what is all together already together mechanically, but in need of boiler work , to what is a full strip down and decide what do you do?
     
  16. 30854

    30854 Part of the furniture

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2017
    Messages:
    2,456
    Likes Received:
    2,371
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Retired
    Location:
    Brighton&Hove
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    ..... and Generalfeldmarschall Helmuth Karl Bernhard Graf von Moltke who said "No plan of operations extends with certaintly beyond first contact with the enemy's main force", adding "Strategy is a system of expedients". Only, he said it in German of course.

    The Chinese Zhou dynasty general and philosopher Sun Tzu made much the same points, only 2500 years earlier, proving he'd have been a useful chap to have around to manage an overhaul!

    Ein Punkt für "Zen und die kunst der Dampflok Wartung"! :)
     
    andrewshimmin likes this.
  17. green five

    green five Part of the furniture

    Joined:
    Apr 30, 2006
    Messages:
    5,502
    Likes Received:
    997
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Hampshire
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    Reading General likes this.
  18. ghost

    ghost Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 29, 2006
    Messages:
    1,951
    Likes Received:
    813
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    N.Ireland
    Bit of a stretch to say that 34058 is 'Under overhaul' isn't it?


    Keith
     
    Shaggy and Swan Age like this.
  19. nine elms fan

    nine elms fan Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 18, 2012
    Messages:
    1,374
    Likes Received:
    207
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    34040
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    Not bad I suppose, but personally I prefer a more diverse show of locomotives like what the Bluebell has or the North Norfolk, a good cross section.
     
    andrewshimmin likes this.
  20. 30854

    30854 Part of the furniture

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2017
    Messages:
    2,456
    Likes Received:
    2,371
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Retired
    Location:
    Brighton&Hove
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    Like 35030?
     

Share This Page