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Modern traction, stuff like Sprinters, Pacers, Voyagers. In future will people want to preserve them

Discussion in 'Diesel & Electric Traction' started by toplight, Dec 26, 2017.

  1. toplight

    toplight Member

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    When modern traction stuff like Sprinters, Pacers, Voyagers, Turbostars, class 158s etc gets withdrawn. Will there be any interest in preserving any such stuff by anyone ? ( The 158s I particularly dislike after travelling in them a lot in the 1990s and always wishing it was a proper train !)
     
  2. Pete Thornhill

    Pete Thornhill Well-Known Member Staff Member Moderator

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    Well there are already a couple of preserved Pacers.
     
  3. AndyY

    AndyY Member

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    I sincerely hope so - history started yesterday.
    Too many things we now regret haven't survived were discarded as 'boring modern rubbish' at the time.

    Andy
     
  4. Back in the 1960s and 70s nobody considered preserving first generation DMUs, class 37s or 47s because they were ubiquitous on the Big Railway and people rarely consider that today's everyday and mundane is tomorrow's history. You could say the same for attitudes towards Black Fives, Bulleid pacifics, trams, trolleybuses and many other aspects of life earlier in the 20th century.

    Or, indeed, main and branch lines which people simply took for granted. As my father said many times "We never thought about it. As far as we were concerned, they would always be there."

    In answer to the question, of course they will.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 26, 2017
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  5. Reading General

    Reading General Well-Known Member

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    Yes they will and fair enough but they shouldn't expect to have them housed courtesy of a steam line.
     
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  6. The Green Howards

    The Green Howards Part of the furniture Friend

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    Yup - vide 10000/1.
     
  7. 35B

    35B Resident of Nat Pres

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    Define “steam line”; I can’t think of any all steam standard gauge railways.

    A 455 is the modern equivalent of an SECR 100 Seater; a 150 of a GWR B Set, etc. They have their place; I worry about the historical credentials of any railway that refuses them a place on purely aesthetic grounds.


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  8. The Green Howards

    The Green Howards Part of the furniture Friend

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    And it was that very sentiment that led to my not photographing my local industrial heritage more, and now that it has all gone... :(
     
  9. The Green Howards

    The Green Howards Part of the furniture Friend

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    I think until recently only the Bluebell could lay claim to that? I'm sure they will, but I hope that people don't go mad and buy too many to keep - I'd say an excessive amount of Class 50s were bought.
     
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  10. 6024KEI

    6024KEI Member

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    I'd be sad if a HST set wasn't preserved - fortunately that seems fairly likely. Would seem sensible that something of the 150-159 series DMU's was preserved - I know there are fair differences in the individual classes but they were a common concept and era. Funnily enough the ones I'd go for are the original 150/0 sets without the corridor fronts - mainly because I recall them on the Cambrian coast when I was on holiday there in the 1980's. 158/9 wouldn't be that great as preserved sets because of the awkward end access and cramped seating. 153 would be fun for a railway as an off peak runabout.

    However unfortunately the electric varients are most likely to end up with the same fate as their earlier cousins - difficult to save because virtually impossible to use them.
     
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  11. johnofwessex

    johnofwessex Part of the furniture

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    I suspect that the problems will be over maintaining 'modern' engines & control equipment.

    This has already been discussed in connection with 'heritage' Diesel loco's & DMU's

    In addition to this I suggest that they may not be very happy pootling about at 25mph on a heritage line
     
  12. Reading General

    Reading General Well-Known Member

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    I didn't say all-steam lines but you can't deny that almost all the current lines have been built on the foundation of steam. The items in question have no place on such a line
     
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  13. johnofwessex

    johnofwessex Part of the furniture

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    Er so given their role in the West Country then you don't think that a 150/153/158/Pacer/Voyager should ever be allowed anywhere near the WSR?
     
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  14. toplight

    toplight Member

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    My original thread post is not really whether they ought to be preserved because they are part of history but whether anyone will want to.

    All locos and rolling stock on preserved lines exist because either individuals or groups chose to buy them. For example I am restoring a GWR coach that was first bought from BR departmental service by a guy in 1980. (he has since died). There were two available, he bought one and other went for scrap apart from some fittings they saved, so had he not intervened, probably both would have been scrapped then. This is the case really with all the vehicles on preserved lines, they exist still because people chose to save them, but will there be people out there that think 'Oh yeah I would like a Class 158 or whatever and spend their time and money saving one. I don't think there will be as to me they have little appeal to anyone even enthusiasts.

    For example check out this website, shows how many of different models of car are left https://www.howmanyleft.co.uk , Put in something like "Mini Metro" and you find there are virtually none left, yet over 1 million were made and they were once a common sight everywhere, but now nobody wants one. I read there are hardly any everyday cars surviving from the 1980s. There are more Austin 7s still on the road than Mini Metros. Will the same happen with Modern trains ?
     
  15. 35B

    35B Resident of Nat Pres

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    Then a number of items on many lines need getting rid of. I suggest the A4 on NYMR would be an obvious candidate; perhaps the Ivatts on the IoW as well. A 150 on the SDR is far more plausible than either.

    However, you do highlight an issue of desire, and how people react to certain trains.


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  16. Pete Thornhill

    Pete Thornhill Well-Known Member Staff Member Moderator

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    That depends on your thinking, are you preserving the WSR as it was or providing a snapshot of West Country railway history in the wider context?
     
  17. Sidmouth

    Sidmouth Part of the furniture Staff Member Moderator

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    Preservation is borne of Nostalgia . will people really be Nostalgic about a Class 150 , 158, 172 ? What is the redeeming quality of any of them for longer term preservation ?

    Where some may find a niche is on community railways but this would be an extension of their working career
     
  18. Reading General

    Reading General Well-Known Member

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    well they aren't really preserving it as it was really, very few lines do that even in passing.
     
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  19. The Green Howards

    The Green Howards Part of the furniture Friend

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    As for cars, try looking at the more 'desirable' cars such as BMW's 5-series. Many of them survive, even if not in operational service (like mine - one of 40 SORN'ed examples of its date and type).

    I'm sure someone will want to preserve more modern, workaday stock - I'd be very disappointed if a 66 wasn't - but the issue is becoming one of space and that modern control systems need more than a file, a pair of pliers and a hammer to maintain them. And yes, the same will apply to cars with their increasing complexity.
     
  20. Reading General

    Reading General Well-Known Member

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    Hardly the point, it doesn't matter to Joe Public, they come to see steam, anything else is clinging to it's coat-tails and there's plenty doing that already
     
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