New-build steam strategy coordination?

35B, I did say from the outset that this dream of mine was just that. If I can ever raise the cash to pursue part of it, great, but if not... and yeah, I am looking to find ways of getting involved in something!

 

Glad to hear it. Please, for the sake of your credibility, focus your posts and desires more on where you canimplication make a difference, and less on (by implication) telling others how to do things.

 

We could always use more guys on 35005 ;-)

 

Getting to Eastleigh is a bit of a bugger from Leatherhead, alas. I did look into it when you were doing Cheltenham down there...

 

Thats a shame, you never know GSN might find a base nearer you

 

Spot on there, I have always thought there is an educational aspect to railway preservation and 35029 is fulfilling this function admirably, if one youngster looks at the innards of this loco and it inspires him or her to take up an interest in steam then it's a job well done. We have more locomotives existing that will ever be needed and the MNs are well represented.

 

And you're the same guy who, in all seriousness, wanted people to get involved with you in a line reopening scheme?

God help us all...

 

Oh? Any information on this? There are a couple of local loco groups, but one (new-build B17) is the wrong side of Woking and the other (although the loco was here in Leatherhead until recently) is now at Isfield...

That a lot of the public turn out to see '28 running... but of course, because '28 is usually tied up with the VSOE Pullmans, they don't get much chance to ride behind her... compared to the north of England, we get shockingly little affordable steam haulage down here in the south-east!

I hoped they might. The ambition I've discussed here is merely a nebulous dream. If ever I had the funds to realise any part of it, a serious business plan would have to be drawn up to support it...

 

Maybe that tells you everything you need to know about the size of the market for steam in Southern England - and the resources available to service it - a market you wish to flood with every Merchant Navy going!

Enthusiasm is good, but it does need a basis in reality ...

Tom

 

The problem is, BB, that by coming out with the statements that you have, you run the risk of being lumped in with the likes of the '45015 resurrection team' and the 'J39 with a copper boiler' gang. Not a good place to be...

 

Also remember you can have the best business plan in the world... and it really doesnt mean b****r all. People have to believe in a project AND the people incharge. The second can be more important some times!

 

actually I would say that the south east has at least it's fair share of steam. Whether there is room for more is debatable.

 

Why though arnt there more regular runs a la Jacobite & Shakespeare Express. Prices on the latter compare favourably with a day on a preserved line

 

Busier train schedules is probably the reason. The brighton mainline and Portsmouth direct are 2 of the busiest railways in the country so isn't that much room. That leaves the South West mainline which is often served by the Dorset coast express and the occasional Swanage Belle. Less chances for trains creates more demand and higher prices

 

Very hard to think of a line in the south east with the spare capacity for such an operation especially if you want a tourist destination at the end; although I will concede Mallaig is a little lacking in that regard, theline itself more than makes up for it.

 

Other factors too... I suspect scenery has a lot to do with a good trip for most people. I live in and love the Surrey hills, but viewed out of a train window they don't really compare to Cumberland or Perthshire...

Actually now I think about it I wonder if the south east english scenery is probably best enjoyed at preserved line speeds: better from the Bluebell than at 70mph on the mainline?

Also you probably don't want to go on a tour on the same line you take to work, so maybe that's another reason to go on tours to the other end of the country...

 

I've said it before, there are lines down here which have room to spare in the schedules and where we generally see a kettle a decade... and some which haven't seen a kettle since 1967... in the latter category one can cite the New Guildford Lines through Effingham Junction, which, while admittedly busy, tends to run empty during the day and where running speeds are rarely higher than 60mph. The Mole Valley line to Dorking and Horsham, particularly quiet on Sundays (when there's no service south of Dorking), very scenic, one kettle a decade (if you're lucky, it seems cursed by diesel substitutions and/or cancellations). Completing the triangle, while the Guildford-Dorking-Redhill line does have the VSOE Pullman, it sees little other steam and the schedule is not exactly crammed. Redhill to Tonbridge, has that even seen steam in preservation? Not sure! There is an untapped market here, it's just a matter of loco/stock/crew availability, and the current operator situation, with DBS a marginal player (air brake only) and WCRC otherwise in a monopoly position - that doesn't help... and, to be honest, I also wonder if it might be possible to replace a routine service working with a steam special where the service would be catering specifically to the tourist market in a given area anyway. I do remember one Sunday in the late 90s having 73096 shuttling back and forth up and down the Mole Valley, and that a lot of walkers were using it to get to Dorking and nearby Denbies and Box Hill.

Even on a busy line, there's no reason why an MN couldn't be allowed to run like hell and cause no disruption to the services around it apart from red tape and on-the-day invocations of Sod's Law by the loco... they certainly seem to get plenty of steam on the Great Western main lines, tripping over 125mph HSTs - and I'd certainly rather take an MN than a Black 5 to Bournemouth! The 75mph limit just seems illogical to me - OK, the Bulleids have 6ft 2ins driving wheels, so at 75mph they're turning (if I've got my maths right!) an additional 25.55rpm compared to a Gresley A4, but their piston speed relative to ground speed is marginally lower - 2ft 10ins per minute less - so if Bittern can do 90mph, there shouldn't be any reason why a Bulleid can't... especially a Bulleid with chain-drive valve gear! The Bulleid's pistons would also be lighter, I'd have thought, being of smaller diameter (by half an inch) than those of an A4 - corresponding to a bore just over 5% smaller in area... so in theory, with rather less reciprocating mass, they could be safe for higher operational speeds than the A4... although I note that even the A4 is only pulling about 1365ft/min at 75mph (2294ft/min at Mallard's 126mph record speed), whereas the highest-performance modern automotive engines (e.g. the 2-litre engine in the Honda S2000) are north of 4900ft/min, equivalent to a 270mph A4(!), so I wonder why a reciprocating steam engine has a much lower piston speed tolerance? Is it purely because the pistons and other reciprocating masses are that much bigger than in any automotive application? I've never been able to find out anything about the weight of motion parts on any steam locomotive.

As for comparing me to some of the Facebook scammers - I'm not asking for anyone's money, I'm not saying "this is what I'm doing". I floated one potential scheme here, it didn't go down well, so that's buried for the time being... what does hack me off are the "such-and-such locomotive fund" Facebook pages which exist for supposedly Severn Valley-based locos which in fact were scrapped at the end of their BR service, with a load of fake updates about loco restoration/operation. If you're going to fantasise, at least be honest about it and/or keep it to yourself...

Jimc, I'm not familiar with Perthshire but my father very much is, and he reckons that the Surrey hills have scenery that compares to any the country has to offer. Not as dramatic as the bleak fells of Cumbria, perhaps, but Newlands Corner, near Guildford (OK, a few miles from the nearest railway...) is one of England's great glories... and the weather's better down here! I'd also rather go from somewhere to somewhere at main line speeds than potter up and down a dozen miles at 25mph... we've got some meaningful gradients too, like Gomshall bank on the North Downs line...

 

BB, the reciprocating masses are a big part of what has to be considered when running fast - even in, for example, motorsport, the pistons are the lightest that can be used. (There, it's a trade off between weight and engine life too; thinner material doesn't dissipate heat as well, & thus will potentially fail due to fatigue sooner than a slightly thicker/heavier component would). Steam locomotive piston/piston rod/crosshead/connecting rod assemblies are very heavy & thus have a great deal of inertia to overcome, both in accelerating and slowing down, during their strokes. Obviously, the bigger the driving wheel diameter, the fewer the revolutions, and thus piston strokes, for a given speed.