Next New Build to be completed

It's an interesting one to look at both groups have different components.

http://www.engine61662appeal.co.uk/

http://b17.tekcraft.co.uk/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=31&Itemid=136

The Manchester group have a replica cab and a full tender (which is in the process of being restored, and is now painted green). The Sandringham group have one tender and a set of tender frames, and of course their newly cut locomotive frames. So neither group - if we were being balanced and fair - is particularly far into their builds.

Arguably between them they have a complete tender, locomotive frames and a cab. That's a good basis for one locomotive. I cannot see them coming together to build one - they are proceeding on parallel lines.

Not really up to anyone to argue they should come together to be honest. They are independent of each other and that's their choice. Full respect to them for trying.

 

I think they actually emerged from one group in the fairly recent past. IIRC the original group was associated with the NBL Preservation Group and it's leader Ken Livermore. Ken currently seems to be associated with the Footballer loco. I'm not sure of the reasons for the split. I don' think it's totally accurate to say that the Footballer tender is being 'restored' - it's had some thin steel placed at the top of the raves and has had a couple of coats of paint, but as I mentioned before they don't seem to have the workshop facilities at their current location so I'm not sure how much progress can be made without moving everything to a railway workshop.

Keith

 

I was being kind I thought. It's certainly a good deal better than simply leaving it in the open rusting, no?

 

Absolutely! I wasn't intending to be unkind to either group, I just think they'd make more progress with better publicity/websites and rail connected workshops. Just a personal opinion!

Keith

 

The last update I saw on the B17 Group was that they sufficient funds to lay rails for the loco to stand (think it was in Heritage Beano) and the cab that had been built was now in a sleeper base. Doesn't bode well tbh. Just waiting for the copper boiler announcement and photos of them at the NRM tracing wheels...

Still, look on the brightside. It has a livery and nameplates!!

 

The B17 is an interesting one, and a loco i would love to see built. I think im right in saying it was one group building a B17 or 2 actually with one being a static fullsize model, with the main chap passing away a few years ago. This is when the B17 Spirit of Sandringham group formed from that to take over the build program. I have no idea if the Manchester United group with Ken Livingston decided to build one without knowing of the other group or not but it think its them who received the cab from the original B17 group. Ken does come on here from time to time so he might clarify.

with regards to income to see the job through to completion i often visit the Charities commission website to see how groups are doing in the funding side. here are some screenshots from the groups (some newbuilds are not charities so i cant get them and others are within a charity, didcot ones it think, so are difficult to find their income)








Its a useful site if you are thinking of putting money into a project but want some assurance things are going in a positive way.

 

Links to the 2 separate B17 websites here starting with the Footballer:
http://www.engine61662appeal.co.uk/index.html

and the "Spirit of Sandringham".
http://b17.tekcraft.co.uk/index.php

Whilst I am not a member of either of these groups I do follow their progress with interest and both groups seem to be progressing more strongly over the last year or so. The Spirit of Sandringham Group were at the Glos-Warks Railway Steam Gala last month where I met some of their representatives and had a good look at their stand. My view of them was of a very polished, professional approach with sound planning and financing models.
I can't speak for the Footballer group as I've never met any of them or seen their display stand (if they even have one) but, again, their website shows increasing progress with the loco.

Very early days for both but, as some of my colleagues who knew these locos in BR service will testify, they were the epitome of East Anglian steam and look forward to seeing at least one run again. I'm optimistic of course but I think both these projects have a future.

 

Not sure, but I was under the impression that the Sandringham group are to be based at Llangollen. There was certainly an information board promoting the project in the shed during SSS4.

Dave

 

I think their frames are being erected there but I don't think its their long term base (engineering or operational).

Keith

 

Are you building ups war chest, Gav? You look like you have had five years of income comfortably exceeding expenditure!

The Atlantic finances are covered within the wider Bluebell Railway Trust figures, but are available in the public domain on the Charities Commission website. They show income of £336k, expenditure £408k over the last five years, with £140k in reserves as at the end of 2014.

As for judging whether things are going in the right direction: seeing regular photographs of big complicated chunks of metal is always handy! I think the 82045 group are exemplars of keeping people informed with regular progress, not just their own donors but also potential donors who, as you say, may be weighing their options.

Tom

 

Haha. No not quite! I wish we did have all that money!!!

I believe the reason it looks that way is due to the way the accounts are done. Every penny that goes on the loco becomes an asset for the same value, so it doesnt come down as expenditure. So if you look at say 82045 that is similar ish theres also shows the same pattern. But there expenses are lower. So you may ask why our expenses are higher say but its again because we do things different from speaking to some of the 82045 guys or 6880 guys (dont know about other projects). EVERY time one of our volunteers goes out doing work for the LMS patriot project they put in an expense claim for a fuel allowance, which a charity is more than entitled to do, which we pay to them, they then (if they wish of course, its their choice) donate it back to us which is classed as a personal donation to the charity with 25% gift aid. 100% legal and gets the charity money for nothing that they can spend on the loco. If i drive 1000 miles doing sales stands @ 35p per mile thats £350 that i can claim for which as a donation back to the charity gets £87.50 in gift aid. I dont know why more charities dont do it.

Gav.

 

Clever stuff!

 

That explains the extraordinary figures for the Clan Project who had to Liquidate an asset(scrap the old frames) and spend to replace them. This occurred shortly after the group had already placed substantial orders for other Major Frame components. This year there is a back log of machining to be done before the final major frame components are put in hand
After all that spend last year theres a bit of catching up to do on the funds side.

Not sure what would come after that, there was some talk of wheels but I think it was the Bogie and trailing truck so to have the Erected Frames mobile when they move to the GCR .
By all means any interested go to the AGM and ask - 11th July at the Bluebell ....

 

As a matter of interest, are the GWS still planning a new build Dean Single? I've heard nothing about it for quite some time.

 

Don't think you'd necessarily expect to. The first stage is surely a paper exercise - a massive trawl to see if they can find enough drawings in the various archives to make the project practical, get all the material together etc. ISTR that in the case of the railcar that took some years. I can't imagine the GWS needs fund raising for that stage, so there's no reason to make any noise. Its not like the one purpose projects that feel they have to cut some tin early to demonstrate they are action not talk.

 

Surely Didcot has a lot going on at the moment? Maybe before starting another new project they should finish the king for mainline, finish Pendennis, finish the County, finish the Saint, finish the 47XX, get the 53XX back running, finish the 72XX. Maybe once a few of those are out running then start the single.

 

True, but there's nothing wrong with succession planning for the next lot of projects

 

A regular poster on one of the Model Engineering Forums (or is it "fora"?) was designing the crank axle and other parts for the proposed Dean single but I believe he was unwell and hasn't posted for 18 months. Unfortunately I fear he may have passed away.
Ray.

 

Peter Rich was involved with a few of the new builds Ray, he used to post as 'taff'. If it was indeed Pete then i'm afraid that he has passed away in early 2014. The following is a useful and interesting read!

http://www.newportmes.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2014/11/March-2014.pdf

The article mentions that he had indeed started work on designing the solid steel crankshaft forging for an 'Achillies' Class 4-2-2.

Kind Regards

Paul

 

I always found 'Taff's' posts interesting and, although I didn't know him, or his real name, I'll miss reading them. Thanks for the information.
Regards,
Ray.