North Yorkshire Moors Railway General Discussion

The Edwards half of the partnership is/was a volunteer on the KWVR. The business has grown massively over the last 3-4 years, at least a dozen railways now use them.

 

Fox & Edwards have given some seats back to the NYMR but I can't lay my hands on the detail at the moment.

 

The fare being charged by the NYMR (£30) does intrigue me. That's for a 36 mile round trip. A round trip from Pickering to Whitby is 48 miles so on that basis an equivalent cost for that journey would be £40, far cheaper than the current £49.50 fare. As the Gresley trains are essentially a premium service I would expect them to command a premium price rather than what appears to be a discounted price.
What's even more bizarre to me is the fact that you can't buy a Pickering-Grosmont return on normal operating days. Well, you can but it is a day rover allowing you to go to Whitby. Someone must have come up with the new ticketing policy but I'd love to know the thought process behind it.

 

And yet earlier in the year, it was £25 to ride in the railcar between Grosmont and Goathland. For £5 more you get teh whole line behind a celebrity steam loco ... (*)

I'm glad it is not just me that is baffled by NYMR fares policy. It feels like no-one quite knows teh value of what they have, and are just groping round for a viable price point.

(*) For the avoidance of doubt, my preference would be the NER 0-8-0; I haven't suddenly been seduced to the dark side of celebrity big chuffers . But I suspect for many people it is a celebrity, and certainly the marketing has pushed that angle.

Tom

 

£13.50 either Goathland to Grosmont or Grosmont to Whitby. £25 was for Goathland to Whitby. You will note that these fares were as per the 2024 season between these stations, and that Annual Passes were valid on these services.

 

Fox & Edwards originally hired out Carriage A and B on the 7 coach service and subsequently gave back (if that is the right terminology) Carriage B for the forthcoming Saturday and Sunday services.

 

Although the booking suggest 7 coaches, looking at videos of today, they seem to be running 8 coach trains. It’s been a while since that was the case. Even better if these have been sold out.

 

The extra coach was added to the train today and clearly there was a demand for it. I travelled through to Pickering on the 12.00 ex Grosmont and had to stand as all eight coaches were full.

Peter

 

There has long been talk at the NYMR of running more "premium services" and these results suggest that there might be demand for them, but (sadly) I don't think that the current management really appreciate that the NYMR is a heritage railway, and perhaps do not have the wit to fully understand and appreciate what an asset they are working for. In short, to revert to a familiar point, they don't know how to treat and market it as a "heritage" railway. If they did, for instance, we would see more urgency in getting one of the prime heritage assets, the teak carriages, running again as something they could exploit and market more thoroughly whilst at the same time restricting their use to "premium" services.

 

While having Morning Coffee on the patio at Newbridge I can confirm that the first train appeared to be very much full to capacity.

 

I believe there's complete agreement on the potential use of the teak carriages for premium heritage experinces rather than as a routine service set. The current impediment is the cost of repairs including new tyres on the brake coach. There are many other pressing demands on available funds, especially infrastructure maintenance and repairs without which nothing can run. The Trust Board has to set spending priorities. At the moment the extra earning potential from special heritage experiences on the teak set doesn't justify diversion of NYMR funds to its repair.

 

60044, you make some very good and valid points in your criticism of the NYMR throughout this thread, but then you also repeatedly undermine yourself with some bizarre digs which frankly seem to be a desperate attempt to find any stick to beat the railway with. This is a prime example.

The SNG group had the opportunity to get the locomotive's overhaul to mainline standard completed by LSL, benefit from the expertise of LSL's engineers, guarantee regular railtour work for the only operational A4 (and on the matching blood & custard stock rather than whatever form of mud WC have painted theirs in recently), bring the locomotive to a wider audience (and therefore hopefully attract more supporters and donors) and have now gained the opportunity to work on the overhaul of 4464 therefore ensuring the retention of skills. That's a fantastic package that no heritage railway in the UK could match.

At the NYMR, 60007 would be limited to running Pickering - Grosmont services at a maximum of 25mph. From what I understand even if she was resident she wouldn't run to Whitby due to the tightness of some of the curves. So through no fault of the NYMR, it's really a no-brainer unless they specifically wanted to keep her close by.

Not only that, but if she was resident, an event like this wouldn't really work or bring the same benefits to the NYMR - it wouldn't be a 'special guest' event, it would just be '60007 is rostered to haul trains today'.

60007 is a fabulous locomotive and would obviously be an asset to the fleet of any Heritage Railway (well, maybe not the likes of Middleton or the Mid-Suffolk but you get my point) but the success of this event doesn't mean that the NYMR would benefit to the same degree if she was there permanently.

 

Premium this, premium that.... a regular trip now has a premium price anyway!

 

That made me wonder what the fare would be if the charge when the NYMR was first created was adjusted for distance and inflation? Those that were around at the time will be able to confirm but wasn’t it £1 return Grosmont CA/Goathland? If so, that would in distance terms equate to£3 for Pickering Grosmont. Inflation means £1 in 1970 is equivalent to just under £20 today. That would make the 1970 equivalent £60 at today’s inflation adjusted value.
Perhaps in real terms the fares are actually a lot cheaper?

 

In turn, in your wish to criticise me, you have overinterpreted what I wrote regarding 60007. I simply said it was a shame that it left the NYMR as its home base, and I stand by that, but I don't think that I criticised either the owning group or the NYMR management for that decision.

There is evidence that in the past, when it was an NYMR resident and usually ran there for the peak smer period, it was a big attraction and did attract people because it was running on a given day - and those days were publicised. Nowadays the NYMR lacks having a popular , well known express engine as its flagship, something it can promote in its advertising, and I think it shows. Sadly, there doesn't seem to be any chance of regaining that position.

 

34101 'Hartland'. I can guess from the above and having just looked at the NYMR web site what the response(s) will be, but I'll still ask! Is there anything more recently known about progress on getting this loco back into service please?
It is one I got a few half decent photos of in the 1960s, plus my 90 mph footplate run on the up Mail in February 1966 when it was struggling for steam - bad coal and lack of a boiler washout.

One of my photos, possibly in September 1962. At Salisbury on a train from Brighton, that I think went on to a WR destination via Westbury.

Bryan

 

There have been recent updates and photos of progress on the firebox. Hartland is the victim of the ridiculous use and then pay for overhaul contracts that have caused pain and grief elsewhere. Fortunately it was the only instance of such an agreement on the NYMR.
No one is suggesting that the time taken to overhaul Hartland is acceptable but at least work on it is progressing slowly unlike some other locos covered by similar contracts.

 

Reports in Moors Line suggest it is progressing slowly - I use the term "glacial" for the rate because it does appear to be very slow! If the implication from the previous post is that this loco could be the new "flagship", though it's not going to be, imho. To me of a certain age with particular enthusiast leanings, perhaps, but to the general public I don't think it will carry the same appeal. I'll be pleased to see it back, but I just don't think it has the charisma of a flagship.

 

Is there any news on which services Bahamas is likely to work on her 8 running days in April ??

 

Which locos would the average NYMR punter view as a charismatic flagship express engine? FS is in a class of its own. On another thread I was poo-pooed for saying an A4 was next although actually I stand by that. After that what else is there? Unless someone did up Green Arrow, wouldn't the best option be 61264, 62005 and hiring in occasional visitors which would not need to pass any kind of authenticity test?