P2 Locomotive Company and related matters

Most grateful for the reply.....certainly be there on Friday.......just hope I'm around when the P2 is up and running....a dream come true....

 

Hi, found an image on line already, hope this link works:

http://www.geocities.ws/fredpipes/trains/p2.html

This is the cigarette card we have - Cock o' The North not Earl Marischal.

The set also includes Princess Margaret Rose, The Turbomotive, Silver Jubilee, Silver Link, Manorbier Castle (streamlined) and a few others from the UK. Most of the set is of overseas locos though. I think we have the full set. probably would have been worth a bit once, but I'm not sure how valuable cigarette cards are these days.

 

Was talking to someone who remembers ER steam few months ago and we both agreed at ground level ER pacifics are huge but a P2 must be Massive! Could well imagine it would be somthing like this.....

 

Excellent day yesterday at the founders day.....boy, is this project buzzing, with monies now pledged over the £1m mark. I am very impressed by Mark Allat, I'm sure without his injection things would be different. I think it was the first time he'd seen the frames assembled.....his face lit up. And is it big.....this is going to be a stonking loco when finished, something I never Imagined I would see. Many thanks to all the folk who have put in the work on this.

 

I think what is clear about the P2 is that people want it to happen, therefore it will happen.

 

For most of the project team the last time we saw the frames was the profiling at TATA. I walked into the works yesterday and just stopped to look for a few moments. The entire team behind the project are very driven and all with unique skill sets that they use for the benefit of the project.

Roll on the next stage. I better get back to my research....

 

It's a shame there doesn't seem to be an ambassador for the project posting on this forum, as in the case of Hengist and The Unknown Warrior for example, although to be fair the website is updated regularly with progress reports and the latest news. I love the idea of the sponsored HGV trailer by the way, it should bring 2007 to the attention of hundreds, or even thousands of people.

I have particularly enjoyed following the development of the CAD model, but I was wondering how much further this can go without a decision being made on which valve gear to use. Surely an announcement on this can't be too far off?

 

Andy Hardy posts here and he is heavily involved, as am I. We will try to bring you news as it happens but the quickest way is probably to follow the project on Facebook.

There is a LOT of research going into the valve gear but a decision is not critical yet and is unlikely to be so for at least a year, by which time we should have a better idea of what form the rotary gear will take. It looks like it will be Lentz/Franklin/Elliott gear!

The CAD model has now reached a working form in which wheels and motion can be turned and we were treated to a 'fly through' of this yesterday - awesome! As soon as this is made available we will try to post it on YouTube and the WS.

Oh, this is the lorry BTW:



Foxy

 

Thanks for the reply Foxy.

That 'fly through' sounds fascinating!!

 

Thanks for the added info Foxhunter, sounds really interesting, especially the Lentz/Franklin/Elliott gear development.

Now I know it's early days to ask this, but is there any idea how this valve gear's porformance could be compared to the more widely known Caprotti valve gear? Just curious as I know it was highly considered at one point.

 

Please do remember that not everyone is on Facebook; some have made a deliberate decision not to hand over all their personal information to a large company.

Noel

 

As have thousands of people who use the site also

 

You can of course be selective about what information you hand over, but any that you put there at all, even if supposedly for restricted access, may not stay that way. Some of us prefer not to touch Facebook with a disinfected bargepole for that reason and, perhaps more to the point, because it doesn't seem to offer us anything that we want except, occasionally, information that someone can't be bothered to provide elsewhere.

Bringing this back to the specific subject of progress on the P2, I would hope that (a) news will continue to appear promptly on their website and that (b) whenever it does someone will post a link here.

 

Well as Foxy has blown my cover I will introduce myself.

My name is Andy Hardy and along with being a member of the A1 support crew and various heritage lines I am also involved with the P2 project as their researcher and archives man, along with being the person mad enough to attempt to colour in black and white images for our use. I have not seen the lorry in person yet but the P2 image used is some of my handiwork: http://www.p2steam.com/news/current-news

So what have I been working on? I collect most of the Trust's historical items, photographs, reports, newspaper cuttings, drawings and anything else relating to the P2 engines and their history. The photographic collection now stands at over 360 images, many of which have never been published, and also some very rare cine film. Hopefully some news will be forthcoming on this and some of it will be come available.

Some will ask why historical stuff is relevant to a new build locomotive. Well in some cases it just gives us the back ground to the original engines and their working lives allowing articles like these to be written:

http://www.p2steam.com/history/nigel-gresley (click on the engine nos. on the right hand side to find out about each)

However the technical research also helps provide information on the new build. One of my main tasks has been the Lentz gear finding historical information and drawings to allow our engineer to design what we require for the new locomotive. In short the original drawings for the Lentz gear do not exist (they were not even supplied to the LNER, the parts were made and produced by Associated Locomotive Equipment who were the Lentz agents, so I have been looking for other sources to help us. Some technical files exist on the P2 in several different museums and collections and these offer details that our engineer can use in his design work. Other engines in the UK built by private manufactures were fitted with Lentz and as they were built in such numbers I cant believe they did not have drawings of their own so I am currently following leads on suitible locomotives that may provide enough drawings for our needs and redesign work (Foxy - I think after the work involved from both of us the new design gear must be called the Elliot-Hardy gear).

I am also following up the Franklin gear angle, basically Lentz gear beefed up and developed by the Americans after the patent ran out. however American preservation and archiving is very different. We often what forget how lucky we are in the UK with facilities like Search Engine, its very different over there.

Anyway enough of my drivel. I will try an copy links of news items onto here for people to enjoy and look at. I cant promise to do everything all the time as I am a volunteer, and with all this research I am about to start a new job on a heritage line on the 1st of August and know life will get busy.

However to finish it off here are two photos from the weekend, one of the first driving wheel casting and one of the frames.





Feel free to ask questions, I cant promise to know all the answers but I will do my best!

Enjoy!

Andy H

 

Have you persued the Crabs avenue Andy ?

 

The crabs are interesting, again very little original design material exists. once again I suspect ALE played everything close to their chests. Our design engineer also ruled them out at an early stage for a reason that I cannot remember right now and asked me to concentrate my research on other avenues. However as i'm not content with half a job i have been looking at and acquiring any information I can to help with the bigger picture.

I'm about to move house, and I have an entire cardboard box (along with a lot of electrons on my PC) of data on Lentz and RC poppet valve gears. May be the subject of an article or book one day..

Andy

 

Suspect that you are right now i recall the crab application was as two independent sets with no provision for connection/ driving a third cylinder and was v similar to the ALE Caprotti used on the later Black 5's and standard 5's... i have a litle account somewhere on how one was chosen above the other (and there wasn't much in it)... Will PM if i find it (for your article if nothing else). Good luck.

 

Sounds interesting, thank you.

 

An update about the weekend's activity is now on the P2 website along with a short clip of video:



Foxy

 

Fascinating stuff Andy. The Associated Locomotive Equipment story and their role in the development of poppet valve technology would be something that I, for one, would eagerly await to see in printed form, if you can get around to it. In the meantime, all the best with your continued research and I hope that the house move goes smoothly too.

Cheers

Alan