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Premise: class 08 never built...

Discussion in 'Steam Traction' started by Reading General, Jan 26, 2018.

  1. Corbs

    Corbs Well-Known Member

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    Thanks guys.

    Ok, another version taking on board some of the operating requirements as mentioned.
    Front steps added.
    Boiler shortened again and cab extended forward.
    Tanks cut down and with sloping front so the crew can see the buffers.
    I'm afraid I don't know what a power reverser looks like so I haven't been able to incorporate one. Ditto removing the superheater.
    Overall the length is still about the same as Victor and Vulcan, should be more within the weight limits.
    I think the push pull gear has been removed.
    The smokebox has been shortened as there is no superheater.

    BR-standard-shunter5-short-2.jpg
    BR-standard-shunter5-2mt-1.jpg

    I'm sticking with the belpaire though ;)

    Here's the long tank version with the same modifications.
    BR-standard-shunter5-long-4.jpg
     
    Last edited: Feb 1, 2018
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  2. Hermod

    Hermod Member

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    Organisations are most efficient when proving, that the ruling gang know what they are doing.
    The A.F.Cook book on LMS boilers does not really find Belpaires better.
    The Germans built 1500 G12 class 2-10-0 and 300(from memory) P10 2-8-2 with Belpaire boxes.
    20 years later they were rebuilt with new roundtop boilers.
     
    Last edited: Jan 31, 2018
  3. pmh_74

    pmh_74 Active Member

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    Fun though this undoubtedly is, the premise is of course nonsense as the class 08 *is* the BR standard shunter, being a mildly updated version of the preceding LMS shunter (BR class 11) in the same way that the Standard 2 is a fairly mild tweaking of the Ivatt 2. On both types the most visually obvious changes are to the shape of the cab, presumably to fit BR’s loading gauge for better route availability. (And in another parallel, both class 08 and class 2 had examples with cut-down cabs for running on specifically restricted lines, but I digress.)

    So I think the correct premise would be “class 11 never built” and then I suspect the 08 would simply have been derived from the Southern or GWR equivalent diesel shunter instead, unless the LMS influence ran so deep in the BR drawing office as to make this politically impossible. Which I doubt, because if you look elsewhere in the BR standardisation programme you find BR only too willing to incorporate the best bits from all of the pre-Nationalisation companies; for example the BR standard box van is basically a hybrid of the GWR sides and LMS ends (but with the roof profile altered as with the steam locos); the BR wagon designers quite sensibly binned the LMS sliding doors fairly early on. (They also binned the flimsy LMS brake rigging though I’ve forgotten where the BR version originated.)

    Anyway, apologies for attempting to distract you all from fantasy land, carry on!
     
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  4. Jimc

    Jimc Part of the furniture

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    Dunno what happened there...
     
    Last edited: Jan 31, 2018
  5. Miff

    Miff Well-Known Member Friend

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    +1 for the Austerity. Riddles was chairman of the committee which chose it (in preference to the LMS submission) as the WD standard shunter. So he might well have kept it in mind had there been a need for a BR version.
     
  6. estwdjhn

    estwdjhn New Member

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    Worth bearing in mind as well that BR already owned a moderate fleet of them, and found they were quite good for both shunting and some other duties!
     
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  7. Reading General

    Reading General Part of the furniture

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    hmm...I knew the title would give problems, perhaps I should have simply entitled it "what would a Standard steam shunter have been like had one been included " and also a trip steam loco . In fact a 57xx or 94xx would cover both these with ease with the exception of lightly laid track where a 16xx would be admirable, so a standard version of these would seem to be the ideal to my mind.
     
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  8. Jimc

    Jimc Part of the furniture

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    Well yes, the real premise is on the lines of "supposing diesel traction couldn't be introduced". I doubt there would have been much difference between a LMS based diesel shunter a GWR based one or a Southern based one since AIUI they all used the same engine and transmission anyway.
     
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  9. 30854

    30854 Part of the furniture

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    The NS (Dutch railways) had a pretty well identical version too. There might even still be a few still kicking around.
     
  10. pmh_74

    pmh_74 Active Member

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    There are some Dutch ones in the UK, I daresay there may still be some over there too. They are closer relatives of the class 11 than the 08 is.
     
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  11. Corbs

    Corbs Well-Known Member

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    I don't know if anyone remembers 'classic trains' narrated by John Peel. There was a segment of the first episode focusing on the big bagnall and the various features it had (especially compared with the Consett long boiler tank earlier in the episode).
    The segment begins at 2:58

     
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  12. RLinkinS

    RLinkinS New Member

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    The picture I posted in #83 (with my tongue firmly in my cheek) had a small vertical high speed engine geared down to the drive wheels. The boiler was a simple round top one. The engine required no maintenance or lubrication (apart from cylinder lubrication) and was located in the smoke box to minimise cylinder condensation losses. its name was "Jimmys Riddle". It had a number of other novel features including a free wheel so you could shut off the engine and coast down hill; there was a clutch to engage for reverse.
     
  13. 240P15

    240P15 Member

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    Thank you so much for posting this video sir!
    I have never heard about these locomotives before, very interesting! They still remains the old original portable frontlamps ;) A bit strange ,though, that the not were equipped with bigger, permanent fitted electrical headlights.

    kind regards :)

    Knut
     
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  14. Corbs

    Corbs Well-Known Member

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    I updated the images in the post above based on comments, removed the push/pull diaphragm and shortened the smokebox as there is no superheater.
     
  15. Reading General

    Reading General Part of the furniture

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    well....I suppose their Mother loves them.....
     
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  16. Corbs

    Corbs Well-Known Member

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  17. Copper-capped

    Copper-capped Active Member

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    Don't worry Corbs, it's only supposed to be a standard after all. ;)

    Well done btw. :)
     
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  18. GWR Man.

    GWR Man. Well-Known Member

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    So when is the facebook new build page and the crowfund be coming live to get this new missing class that never existed to get this engine built.:D
     
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  19. 30854

    30854 Part of the furniture

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    Unlikely to happen before the new LNER U1 is wheeled I'd imagine.
     
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  20. Corbs

    Corbs Well-Known Member

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    Haha! Ugly ducklings aren't they!
     
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