Saving 3 Cig 1498

ah leave him alone, the only difference between him and me (and most people I guess) is I keep my dreams to myself. What he hopes to achieve one day is a damn sight better than going tagging rolling stock or worse.

 

A good point well made, RG. It's very easy to 'mock the afflicted', as we used to say - especially from the anonymous safety of behind our keyboards - but he's not spending his spare time spraying graffiti, setting fire to signal boxes or otherwise destroying the work of other people.

Nobody is making anyone give him money - and if anyone does they will have to take responsibility for their own actions - so maybe we should all lay off him and the rest of the fantasists.

If you deny people the oxygen of publicity by ignoring them, they tend to disappear quite quickly.

 

Here's a cautionary tale worth reading which is very relevant with regards to budding preservationists using crowd funding... http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-35356147

Key paragraphs:

"... he describes ... the disaster which unfolded as Reedman and his colleagues discovered they just did not have the skills or the experience ..."

"... he concludes that neither he or the other members of the team "possessed the technical or commercial competencies necessary..."

"He also wants Kickstarter to be far more explicit about the nature of the risk backers are taking - and more active in weeding out weak projects before they are funded."

As always before parting with your money for anything, caveat emptor...

 

Ok.
How many of you who are dismissing this idea, have actually got your hands dirty with railway preservation?
And if my gut feeling is right not many.
Some of you should be ashamed of kicking someone who has the drive and enthusisam to actually put his head above the parrapet.
At least he is trying which is more than can be said for some of the keyboard experts on here.

Now...Stuart.
Hands up to you for having the Bow Locks for having a go.
Dont dismiss those who have suggested that you join an established group so that your knowledge may grow and you gain more experience.
They are right in what they say.
Also the issue with the dreaded health and Safety, rules and regs, also it was alot easier back in the early days (not that I was there)..all the comments regarding these are true.

If I may be able to give some advice...... keep going with this one and if it doesnt work out go and join an established set up and start at the bottom and be willing to learn and listen
You will gain so much experience and knowledge that in the years to come you will be in a better position for whatever project you might want to run.

Kat

 

I think you'll find that many of the people dismissing Stuart's ideas have indeed got their hands dirty in preservation, and base their scepticism on that experience. The advice for Stuart to get involved with an existing project and work up from the bottom is indeed sound, has been offered before numerous times, and always ignored.

If you have been on the forum for a long while, you will be aware that Stuart has launched numerous projects without any of them gaining any traction. Being generous, you could at least say they display a refreshingly broad set of interests: from memory, at least four new build steam engines of GWR, SR and LNER prototypes; at least one attempt to restore a Barry wreck; and now this attempt at an EMU. I may have missed some. About the only common threads are that all have been launched with appeals to set up committees to do various bits of work; all seem to have mistaken gaining Facebook "likes" with actual solid engineering or project management; and none has lasted beyond an initial flurry of activity on social media. So I think you might forgive a few people on here for being a bit jaded every time a new scheme is launched.

Tom

 

Absolutely correct Tom!


Keith

 

As others have already pointed out you will find that many of us who have advised Stuart have been at the 'sharp end' of the preservation movement and have, indeed, "got our hands dirty". It is interesting that you state that you do not currently volunteer.
Ray. (volunteering since 1966)

 

I,ll have to update my profile then....

 

Stuart if you are serious contact one of these organisations below to find out more information on keeping and restoring a class 421 unit.
Unit 1753 based at Finmere station - http://www.nsers.org/
Unit 1399 based at Dartmoor Railway - http://www.400series.co.uk/
Unit 1497 based at Mid-Norfolk Railway - http://www.southernpreservationgroup.com/
Also note you would more than likely need a push-pull fitted diesel locomotive unless you want the locomotive to run round at the end of the line.

 

If you do decide to haul with a normal diesel you need to aquire/ make air pipe extenders to link the waist mounted air pipes on the CIG to buffer beam air pipes on the diesel. They are simply a length of air pipe with conectors both ends. At a guess I would say 2 feet long but only glimpes them in the cab of a 33

 

Read post 21 of this thread. Stuart has been given sound advice from numerous individuals in the past, many highly experienced within the preservation movement.

He has ignored each and every one of them, as his only interest is of being in charge (if he isn't, why has he not continued with the WSR and helped on the GWR Coaches, 4561 etc etc ? - they all need saving still after all!). This was best highlighted with 2859, when he seemingly found someone interested in financing his ideas, but at the last minute pulled out when they realised they'd be doing all the work.

Nothing's changed, except for what he's wanting to restore/save/build this week. When this dies a death it won't be long before the next Facebook Group appears, and we all try to offer the same advice only to be ignored once again. As I said previously, don't be surprised when everyone ignores this appeal just the same.

 

when I left the wsr 4561 went off to Swindon there was no heritage carriage project and 6412 was still in traffic on the wsr , just because I don't follow peoples advise doesn't mean I haven't taken it on board. Also just to clear it up they didn't back out because they thought they would be doing all the work, it was because they didn't want to take out another mortgage on their house incase the group could not raise the money to pay for the repayments each month. I don't want to be fully in charge I just want a say in what happens to her

 

thanks for the info

 

I think this should be submitted to the Oxford dictionary as the best ever definition of 'a lucky escape'!

It does rather worry me that someone wants other people's money to preserve a piece of kit, but evidently knows so little about it that this really basic piece of info is obviously news to them.

I can imagine the CIG bowling merrily along, fouling crossovers and pointwork. "Er, you need to tie the collector shoes up." "Thanks for the info."

 

Total fund is now up to.................

£12

Yes, someone else has committed a whole £2 to the project (with only 16 days of fundraising remaining). Probably Stuart just so he can claim he's 'done his bit' for the fund.

Hint for you Stuart - if you're looking to raise £35k, most people would assume that you'd be putting in at least £1k of your own money in order to take you seriously (in addition to all the other serious items that have been mentioned to you but which you are ignoring).


Keith

 

That's good to know. But how have you taken it on board?

 

There will be a website for the group. http://3cig1498.weebly.com/ (website currently down until 1 February) https://www.facebook.com/1498group/posts/1661579774091220

 

To quote the FB page "Just to remind you all the website goes live on 1st February, Thanks, Stuart"

 

Well that's 20 minutes of my life I won't ever get back - reading this thread (although it does make nice change from people whinging about diesels on the back of charter steam trains).

This guy is clearly clueless when it comes to the practicalities of preservation and my only concerns would be: 1. he might get the whole movement a bad name and stop genuine funds coming into preservation (and particularly EMU which is notoriously hard to fund-raise for) and 2. he might be ripping people off - starting new schemes and then the money disappearing - although at the present rate of progress that doesn't seem to be a big risk.

If he really likes EMUs there's a pile of them at Coventry that are not improving - if he doesn't like EMUs why even think about a 3-CIG?

Anyway, back to my search for some positive news on the 4-SUB