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Sir Keith Park

Discussion in 'Steam Traction' started by shedbasher, Jun 29, 2012.

  1. nickt

    nickt Member

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    Back on topic there's an update on Sir Keith Park, etc, on the SLL website today: http://www.southern-locomotives.co.uk/News/news.html
     
  2. Bulleid Pacific

    Bulleid Pacific Part of the furniture

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    Interesting account of BR green...
     
  3. dhic001

    dhic001 Member

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    Especially when you consider its on the website of the group who own Manston, which is clearly in Brunswick, not either version of BR Green! Ironic?

    Daniel
     
  4. Bulleid Pacific

    Bulleid Pacific Part of the furniture

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    Not when you consider that Brunswick green was used by a constituent of the Southern. Taking this into the livery context, are we in a position to discover whether or not in some instances various works could not find the right tin of paint and slapped on the next best thing that came to hand? It certainly happened with the nameplates of BBs, which were also painted red and black at various points. Looking at the tender lining of 76084, it certainly puts a question mark over the rigour surrounding BR's insistance on uniformity. Furthermore, the lining given to the unrebuilts was 'non-standard', as I have read somewhere that BR generally insisted on vertical bands. The lining of the Bulleids as-built created a bit of a problem in this regard, and so a non-standard approach was tolerated.
     
  5. Richard

    Richard New Member

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    They also appeared in two shades of blue! The original mid-blue and from c.1963, due to an error, a lighter blue. The red used for the WC nameplates differed as well as this was the same as used for the buffer beam and SR used a lighter red.
     
  6. Steve

    Steve Resident of Nat Pres Friend

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  7. Jamessquared

    Jamessquared Nat Pres stalwart

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    To be really certain of how things really were, I think you need information about the specific formulations, and also working methods (number of coats; which base coats were used; number of coats of varnish etc). I certainly wouldn't rely on names. For example, in Adams' day, he painted his locos "Pea Green", but Drummond introduced a change to "Royal Green". Looking at the paint formulations, there can't have been much difference between them. Stroudley painted his passenger engines green as well, but I doubt many people today would even describe that colour as green! Whether he was colour blind, or whether he was having a sly joke at someone's expense, is a matter of academic curiosity these days.

    And all that is before you think about weathering. Old fashioned paint formulations with lead-based pigments tended to darken on exposure to atmospheric sulphur compounds. Other pigments might fade in sunlight. For example, eye-witness accounts suggest that some LSWR greens faded over time to a rather blueish shade. So it would be entirely possible today, using modern pigments, to accurately reproduce the finish of a 60-year old locomotive colour, but then find that after a year in the sun, the modern pigments had faded in a way quite different to how the originals would have faded.

    Tom
     
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  8. houghtonga

    houghtonga Member

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    I believe Airfix had a lot to answer for with their 'OO' gauge plastic kits of the 1950s/60s (now sold by Dapol).

    The instructions for Evening Star, City of Truro, Railcar, 61xx, Unrebuilt West Country and others specified Humbrol's Brunswick Green as the closest paint match, thus giving rise to the myth that it was the GWR/BR livery.
     
  9. Steve

    Steve Resident of Nat Pres Friend

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    Going O/T but sticking with green paint, I did some research into finding what NER 'Saxony green' was. In doing this I discovered that every preserved loco in NER green livery is painted a different colour. In the end, I obtained from the Ken Hoole Trust a swatch apparently liberated from Darlington works in 1958 by Bob Hunter, onetime curator of the original York Railway Museum, which was labelled something along the lines of NER standard livery and lining details and was also kept out of any light so shouldn't have altered. There was associated correspondence dating from 1958 so it has a good provenance. This was also different from any other NER green painted loco in preservation. I had a batch made up by Williamson's which matched the swatch exactly and it is now in their catalogue as Saxony Green.
    So forget Brunswick Green and paint your locos Saxony Green, instead!
     
  10. Rumpole

    Rumpole Part of the furniture

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    Is that before or after the repaint last spring?
     
  11. b.oldford

    b.oldford Member

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    I suspect the original culprit was actually Rosebud Kitmaster. Airfix and Dapol merely perpetuated any mistake. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rosebud_Kitmaster
     
  12. spanner

    spanner New Member

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  13. twr12

    twr12 Well-Known Member

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    Members of this forum would be horrified by what it says on the tin......
     
  14. Spamcan81

    Spamcan81 Nat Pres stalwart

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    I saw a number of BB plates in store at RAF Cardington in the 70s and believe me, more than two shades of blue were on display. Where one was taken carefully back to bare metal, several layers of paint could be seen and quite a difference between the layers.
     
  15. Martin Perry

    Martin Perry Nat Pres stalwart Staff Member Moderator

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    It all just reinforces the idea that (within reason) there is no such thing as a wrong colour. There must have been different batches of what was nominally the same colour, with slightly different compositions, which resulted in differing shades on drying, different fade rates etc etc.
     
  16. Bulleid Pacific

    Bulleid Pacific Part of the furniture

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    Ah well. Anyway, another share form is now winning its way to assist with 34072's overhaul- I've been threatening to do so for three years since I finished paying for the one towards 34053. I have a little history with 34072 locomotive in that it was the first unrebuilt I'd ridden behind. I remember the excitement of seeing it at Herston over ten years ago whilst on a camping holiday with my father, and enjoyed a fantastic day out; the memory lingers on. It must've been the turning point for my regional and motive power affiliations...

    Suffice to say, its now one (part-owned with hundreds of others) locomotive, one volunteership on a heritage railway, a railway-related BA, MA and currently PhD, 9 Hornby Bulleids and over 9,000 miles on the national network later, not to mention the number of trips on heritage railways. Some people say I need to get out more, but I promptly inform them of their error- the hobby has taken me all over the country. Regardless, doesn't time fly when you're having fun!
     
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  17. minty4371

    minty4371 New Member

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    What is the latest update on the repairs to 34053 please? Haven't heard anything for a while now. Thank you.
     
  18. Bulleid Pacific

    Bulleid Pacific Part of the furniture

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    Still under repair, and will be ready when it's ready. I believe the hope is to get it into traffic by the end of March for the 2014 season, but as with anything in this game, things can slip.
     
  19. nickt

    nickt Member

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    Sir Keith Park back in service on Severn Valley Railway this weekend. Well done to the Bridgnorth engineering team.
     
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  20. Spamcan81

    Spamcan81 Nat Pres stalwart

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    Excellent news.
     

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