Discussion in 'International Heritage Railways/Tramways' started by Saint, Jul 4, 2017.
Well done on the certificazione!! A first in Italy.
The only privately owned, mainline certified steam loco?
I think not.
While I don’t know the status of MFP (Piedmont Railway Museum) engines, there’s a 740 engine owned by La Spezia transport museum and operated by Fondazione FS under its flag, and that should be certified by Fondazione, but I don’t know the details.
Our engine is the first certified this way, nevertheless.
Congratulations on the steam loco certification; it must have been immensely frustrating to have a fully functional steam loco and not be allowed to steam it.
Could you post a fuller picture of the ‘double point’, as you call it? From the one posted it’s not easy to see exactly what this is or what’s special about it.
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For sure, as soon as possible. We call it "scambio inglese". I apologize for my poor technical vocabulary, checking on the net, it should be a "double slip switch".
About the story of that switch. It was built for Südbahn and installed in the San Candido/Innichen station (Val Pusteria/Pusterthal railway). When the station PW was renovated, the switch was moved to the now closed Verona Porta Vescovo museum, and when the museum was closed, with the help of the Mazzi railway works company (the same that rebuilt the PW in our locomotive depot) we recovered it, but as a "construction kit". A problem, even Mazzi, who dismantled it in the first place, was unable to rebuild it, being a very peculiar pattern. Luckily, the Rovereto (TN) Public Library held a rare copy of the manual of the Austrian build PW components that were left in Italy after WWI. So a couple of members went to the library and photographed every single page of the manual, and that helped in rebuilding the switch.
Anyway, I found this clip in our YouTube channel showing the first test of our Sogliola, not completely rebuilt, and it pass over the double split.
We called the Sogliola in that state "Versione Coloniale" (Colony Pattern) since those used in North Africa on the railway to Tobruk ran without the upper cab to increase the driver comfort.
Ah, thanks, yes we’re familiar with double slips (and indeed single slips) in the UK. Awkward things but sometimes what is needed. Is this one just rare because of its age and origin?
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I was pretty sure you were familiar ("scambio inglese" translates in "English switch"), it was just my fault, lack of competence in British railway jargon. After all, despite the Italian word for railway (ferrovia - iron way) being a loan translation from the German Eisenbahn, Italian railways have a very strong British origin.
As for the switch itself, it is rare for the origin and for the age, that make it the sole of its kind on the Italian railway network. Other rarities are the turntable, always of Austro-Hungarian origin, again a signle sample on the Italian network and some old axles of the pre-steel era and one of the last surviving Fb freight cars, certified for the British railway network.
I referred to the Italian railway network because SVF, when its "train service" will start, will nor use private rails but part of an active branch line (Bassano del Grappa - Trento line between Bassano and Pergine) and therefore, according to local regulation, will need a driver and a guard employed in a certified railway company. That is one of the problems left to solve, and the solution will be an agreement with a local railway that will "supply" a driver and a guard working for a railway company;
Indeed it is a minefield in Italy, the regulations and the requirements that need to be gone through to be able to operate a rail vehicle on public or private lines.
There were long discussions about running on a disused line near Turin which got more and more complicated to the point where the idea was abandoned.
Years ago I had high hopes of similar operations to the UK but 20 years later no such line has been able to establish themselves, until now, which is why SVF Primolano is one of the most exciting developments in Italian railway preservation.
I really do wish you every success and if only I lived a little closer...
Was that near Turin a project by MFP (great people, good friends)? Our Corbellini coach comes from there! (see https://www.societavenetaferrovie.i...iemontese-consegna-a-svf-la-carrozza-b-38416/. Sadly, pictures went lost)
Thank you for your words, thank you! BTW, we have sleeping accommodations in the shed, it is not the Ritz or the Savoy, but the shower is hot.
But don't worry, knowing that there's people that likes our work and sends us good wishing is really corroborating.
Yes there were many discussions years ago and then the plan with the 60cm line round the museum and then FERALP, but you can still dream! MFV in Valsesia could be a similar operation but for now it's regular Fondazione FS trains. I have my 'casa di montagna' near Varallo so that will be one of my retirement projects.
Google says only 4 1/2 hours drive from home to Primolano, just round the corner!
We say that dreams are made of steel...
Indeed it’s a long way to Primolano for you, thrice my travel time.
And I have to correct a bit my previous post, shed accommodations are for the members only.
An interesting video published a couple of days ago by the company who overhauled 880.001.
Lovely. I was lucky to visit there probably 3 or 4 times during that restoration as that is just 35 minutes from home and I had another two projects running there. Always a pleasure to be there and I keep dreaming of buying one of the locos awaiting restoration.
The launch event was a nice day out and even my wife commented on the quality of the work, before moving on to the food and drink. Giordano and the team at Lucato are great guys.
What a fantastic sight at the end showcasing what could be possible as an Italian heritage railway operation. That short mixed train is a real credit to all at Primolano who have invested time and money to realise their dreams. I salute you.
I know it's not easy to tell the quality of work from a video, but their work does look impressive, especially from a pretty unassuming industrial unit. I knew they'd overhauled quite a few locos there, but didn't realise they had the boiler from SNCF 230 G 353 there.
The Valsugana line is spectacular, so, as you say, a nice little branch line train trundling along will be fantastic.
Thanks for sharing this video, it is about two years old.
I was there during the launch event, maybe you noticed a large, long haired person with the 880.001 t-shirt and a very happy face. I recall with pleasure the pride of the man that worked tirelessly on the super heater, to give us the most lasting possible pieces.
About the restoration, a couple of things are to be said. The first thing is that the engine, from its dismissal from active duty until 2004, was the "pet project" of a rolling stock maintenance firm in Cittadella, now closed. It was left in the open for 2 year after the "Officine di Cittadella" workshops demolition and SVF took it in 2006. While in the hands of Officine di Cittadella no work was performed on the boiler - except linking the air brake reservoir to the regulator, to move the engine with the air stored in the brake circuit. On the other hand, the lower part was in mint condition even after 2 years of staying in the open. One anecdote from 2006. The engine was took from Cittadella and brought to Padova Interporto (current Padua freight station) by road transport on August 24, 2006. On October 12, 2006 - I got the dates scavenging the news section of http://www.societaveneta.it, I have not this strong memory- it was moved by rail to the railways workshops in front of the former Padova freight station, Padova Campo di Marte. Before the transfer, both Trenitalia Cargo and RFI demanded to asset the state of the engine, how much it squeaked. They hook the 880.001, that was properly lubrified by the volunteers, hook it to a 141 class heavy shunter and moved it back and forth on a long siding in Padova Interporto station. For the last run, the engine of the shunter was set to idle to hear distinctly the noises from the 880. There was non face more amused than those of us, SVF volunteers, and none more surprised than that of the railwaymen: the noisiest engine was the heavy shunter. After that last test, the train (heavy shunter, 880.001 and the FF van) started towards Campo di Marte. Their speed should have been 30Km/h, therefore I was pretty shure I could have reaced ahead of the train with my speedy city car. Nope, the train was able to run much faster and I had to be quite reckless to catch it up .
This is a picture of the engine before restoration:
It is missing the main rods that where removed for the road transport from Padova Campo di Marte to Primolano.
And this is a video of an event that happened 4 years before the restoration tug of war: 880.001 vs 30
Please note the large, long haired chap acting as he's pulling everything .
And now some pictures of SVF activities. As I said in a previous post, we had a training session regarding shunting the rolling stock on our yard. I can share now a couple of pictures.
Our teacher Sergio, Station Master - retired - while instructing the volunteers...
... all paying the due attention to the teacher words (including the large, long haired fellow).
Riccardo, our freshmen engineer, demonstrates coupling operations (yes, the van on the left was enabled to run on the Great Britain network, too) in the practical part of the day...
and then the brake pipe. Sergio explains the correct sequence and why it is the correct sequence of opening the valves.
and finally our Station Master explains how to operate a switch.
(about the voices in the background: we were showing where the rails ended before the reconstruction of the yard. About where the Sogliola is parked, there was a buffer, and the buffer was some 20 meters ahead of a switch, with the "frog legs" toward the buffer. Opposite to the buffer you could have go either toward the turntable or to a track leading to switches for the two shed tracks or to the now dismantled station siding that took to the shed. All engines going to the station from the shed (and vice-versa) had to do a forward-backward-forward z-shaped routine that ensured that no train could escape to the mainline even without locking the switches.)
On November 30th, following last October certification and again under the supervision of TÜV technicians, SVF run a full functionality test of the boiler and its auxiliary devices.
Taking advantage of the occasion, we formed a consist with what will be the official formation of the heritage train that is a fundamental part of the project described in the "Istituzione della Ferrovia Turistica della Valbrenta" resolution of the then Cismon del Grappa municipality (now consolidated in the "Valbrenta" municipalities union). It is a project SVF continues to believe strongly in, and that might act as a flywheel for the local touristic and occupational development.
The attending fellows all take a chance to ride on our train running in our yard, most had a first class ride in the two axles coach, some had a cab ride and some enjoyed what we call the guard seat, sort of an one person compartment always in the two axles coach.
The little coal bunker on the left side of the cab, the engineer's controls are on the right side. This was "the old way" to build Italian locomotives.
Our technical sponsor logo.
Hitching a ride... The destination board refers to the now discontinued Primolano-Bassano-Cittadella-Vicenza service, a direct link to the province capital now replaced by bus service .
On the left, the FF freight van that will be part of the preserved train consist once the "main line" service starts.
And now an image from the past from another YouTube video
Our shed during the restoration works at minute 4:07.
Guessing why our work slows in winter? Here is a clue:
As our shed is not constantly manned and heated and temperatures fall often below zero due lack of direct solar lighting, we empty the pipes and keep them dry until we are sure that freezing is over. Nevertheless works go on even if two days shifts will return once temperatures rise.
In the meanwhile, SVF has released its 2020 schedule, please double check the https://www.societavenetaferrovie.it/eventi-e-manifestazioni/ web page for confirmation.
Primolano Open Days:
May 17th, 2020, from 09:30 AM 5:30 PM
June 28th, 2020, from 09:30 AM 5:30 PM
Seprember 13rd, 2020, from 09:30 AM 5:30 PM
October 11th, 2020, from 09:30 AM 5:30 PM
Cabina A Open Days
April 26th 2020 14:30 18:00
Jun 14th 2020 14:30 18:00
July 12th 2020 14:30 18:00
September 06th 2020 14:30 18:00
October 04th 2020 14:30 18:00
WE ARE NOT DEAD!
It's true, some of us live in a yellow zone and most of the media communication favor panic striking titles, we are well an Italy is not dead. Yes, there are difficulties and precautions must be taken. But, frankly, any railway volunteer says "what's new" when you talk about difficulties or precautions.
Ok, being serious. Even if the thermometer is still in the cold area, exploiting a sunny day, our volunteers went to Primolano to somewhat inaugurate the Yard Gang ("Gruppo Piazzale" in Italian), the team charged of the works in our yard permanent way and surrounding.
We have several items that need a more protected placement while awaiting restoration and others that deserve more evidence, like the mid nineteenth century part cast - part wrought iron axles that were used in dolly truck to move coaches bodies in the Cittadella Workshops - the very one that preserved 880.001 before SVF.
Today our Sogliola had its share of work, and the work Andrea did on her fuel pump really paid off.
After completing the balancing of the turntable, we had to test it and we did it using some of our rolling stock awaiting restoration.
First the Eklo wagon [(C) Federico Rigobello - 2020]
then the F van [(C) Federico Rigobello - 2020]
and finally the DE424.004 engine [(C) Federico Rigobello - 2020]
that has been successfully turn around, meaning that the platform is ready for this summer open days.
Our calendar, should you dare a trip this summer in the virus plagued Italy north east (BEWARE OF ZOMBIES ) where posted in the previous message.
This is just a note.
WE ARE ALL ALIVE.
Nevertheless we understand and support the efforts our government has enacted to slow down the spread of the virus.
If all goes well, our planned open days should have no or little change. If problems arise, we will act
We all hope to have all of you among our esteemed guests in our future open days. Our wholeheartedly best wishes, we wish you all the best.
And yes, there are news waiting... We are in stand by, we are healthy, we are confident.
Take care, we hope you and all your friends and family stay safe.
Separate names with a comma.