Steam v Diesel

At the moment they only have 5428 as a registered Network Rail steam loco until 44806 is available. I don't know what the problem was with 5428. Things are a little on the tight side because the only other NR registered loco is D7628. Not only on the tight side with NR locos but generally, with only 29, 2392, 80136 and 92134 available. On a normal day, the T/T requires two NYMR only locos, one NR steam and one NR diesel and all but one has to be OK with 7 coach trains.

 

Maybe if the Engineering Director spent less time poncing around acting like a TV celebrity the steam fleet might be in better shape!

 

5 Steam locos in traffic and 2 diesel, one of each is mainline registered, I'd call that pretty good shape. I know 5428 has had some electrical faults in the last week or so, but they're intermittent and have been difficult to track down. Turn's out sensitive electronics don't always play nicely with a steam locomotive.

 

Jonnie - being relatively small, how do you manage competence? Do operations staff automatically progress on both steam and diesel, or do you have some that are "steam only" and others that are "diesel only"? And if so, how do you manage rostering - for example, what happens if you are in a position where your only available driver is "steam only", but the daily diagram is planned for a diesel?

And what about fitters and their ability to diagnose and repair faults?

(The comment about being small isn't intended to be derogatory, but rather that the smaller an organisation is, the more that you need generalists, not specialists).

Tom

 

When the diagrams call for three steam and one diesel each day and three of those have to be 7 coach capable yet two of the five are only 4/5 coach capable, I’d say that was a bit of a motive power crisis rather than good shape. It will undoubtedly ease with the entry into service of 926 and 44806, though.

 

I agree with @Steve on how tight the fleet seems. I'd also observe two further things:
1. Only having a single Whitby diesel is cutting things very fine for contingency; and
2. Intermittent electronic faults linked as you describe to "sensitive electronics don't always play nicely with a steam locomotive" is precisely why contingency needs to allowed for more.

 

After an ORR audit in 2019 highlighted numerous issues I completely overhauled our Competence Management System.

We are split steam and diesel but people can and do both (I sign steam and diesel traction for example) but most decide to do one or the other for their enjoyment. If we have a day of no steam crew we just run diesel, I've very rarely ever had a day of no diesel and a steam crew, I just make a call based on what's going on. Sometimes it works out better financially running diesel vice steam if we've got no dining or kids events taking place.

Our engineering staff are qualified via external training and assessment or they're trained in house and assessed using our own standards which we've created, checked and authorised in the same way a mainline company would.

 

Thank you.

Tom

 

I wonder whether the Riley fleet of black 5's will save the day (especially as they are not needed at Fort William at the moment)

 

I went to Whitby on the train last weekend and talking to the volunteers the change to how the coaches are going to be soon is not a good thing in my opinion it’s going to be very hot on there in the summer

 

Only after the GB I would suggest, even if it is an option. But one may be needed along with 34067 for the RTC tours.

 

I'm guessing windows shut whilst on NR?

Sent from my moto g(7) play using Tapatalk

 

All windows are only going to opened to a point where you can’t get your head out

 

Steve can I pull you up on that point please? As someone who many years ago got their hands dirty in the ‘muck and nettles’ with several Class 50’s, a Warship, components of a Class 52 that has vied with Jason Statham on the big screen and a 27 at Kidderminster as a teenager.
I really think your doing a massive disservice to quite a few groups that have put their steeds through quite through and comprehensive overhauls.
(How on earth has D821 managed half a century in preservation with the residual life in it after its last BR overhaul?)

I appreciate that Diesels aren’t really your thing but I do suggest you have a look at what the likes of A1A locomotives, The DEPG, The DTG, The Class 20 Locomotive Society, The DPS, The WLA , The 50 Alliance and the Class 40 Preservation Society amongst others have done in the last 30 to 50 years to keep those machines in operation.

I really don’t want to sound sarcastic but Im willing to bet a king size Mars Bar you haven’t seen the facilities that the DPS have at Barrow Hill or the purpose built facilities at Kidderminster that the DTG and 50 Alliance have?

 

I did say the majority and I’ll stick by that statement. There are a lot of locos that are not owned by dedicated groups and are probably living on borrowed time. Loco owning groups have also generally acquired a significant spares holding and this helps keep them operational and the costs down. It’s when those spares run out that the tru costs will come to the fore.

 

You can argue the same point about steam locomotives though, hasn’t a certain owner of a 3 cylinder Stanier 4-6-0 said ‘one more go and that’s it?’

 

We know that a major refurbishment of a large main line steam loco after about twenty years of use is going to be approaching seven figures at todays prices. I've no idea what an equivalent cost for a main line diesel would bet. If you're saying that these groups have put their locos through the equivalent of a major overhaul there should be a good indication of how much it costs to put diesels through such an overhaul. By that, I'm not talking about simply swapping major components from the stock of spares but major refurbishment or replacement of them. I'm sure there would be more than me who are interested in the answer. It's information that is needed to make a true comparison of costs between steam and diesel rather than the simplistic coal v oil costs. Diesels are a cheap option for heritage railways because owners generally don't charge much to hire them out but is this selling them too cheaply?

Edited to add a nought to a steam loco overhaul cost!

 

One assumes you mean 7 figures!

 

I did! Since edited. I'm more used to small industrial locos where I hope six figures is still the norm.

 

I don't think anybody has mentioned DMUs in this thread. They surely are the least cost way of enhancing a mainly steam operated time table whilst having the added attraction of forward & rearward view which are otherwise impossible.