Streamlined Duchess, past and future

Fella, he just apologised!

Look at this picture: http://www.photos2use.co.uk/images/galleries/4/duchess-of-hamilton.jpg

then this picture: http://www.warwickshirerailways.com/lms/lnwr/brinklow/lnwr_brin1093.jpg

Then the little tiny handles where the whiskers meet are wonky.

Also, it doesn't matter, as a streamlined Princess Coronation is absolutely stunning

 

Guaranteed to upset many, but if we wanted Mr Branson to put up some money to put a West Coast Classic on the mainline, he will need to benefit from the publicity. If it buys a 10 year ticket, how about, just for one year, a Steam Pendolino. I'm sure the Photoshop guys can mock up a duchess in Virgin Livery. After the year and Virgin's bang for their buck the livery could be restored.

 

All very well sitting in a Coronation cab dreaming of being a fireman, but we could have done with your eagle eye when we were working 18 hour days trying to finish it on time. If you had been really eagle eyed, and absorbed the details of D37 14897 you would have also noticed that there are two further commode handles (to give them their correct LMS title) and a lamp bracket missing, which we shall get around to finally fitting when opportunity presents itself. You really must work harder if you are going to pick nits properly.

regards
Bob

 

What about SR magazine putting appeal out for 46235 City of Birmingham. When did she last turn a wheel in anger?

 

std tank, if you want to discuss the finer points of re-streamlining a Duchess I suggest that you come to Tyseley on 24 Oct and speak to the people who gave up their weekend with their families to get her finished on time. I'm sure Bob wont mind me telling you that some of them finished work at 2.am on the day she was delivered back to York.
Also when we arrived at York and the passengers that were waiting for a trip behind Tornado all stood and applauded as we passed through the station.....enough said.

 

Bob, thanks for your post. Missing parts are not noticable to the general public, but an item put in the wrong place is. As I said in one of my posts, my sister noticed it and she is no engineer.

 

Birmingham City Council are a bit touchy about the black Duchess sitting in a corner of The Think Tank.
When the plan for the new New Street Station were revealed I contacted them and suggested that it would be a great advertisement for the city to have 46235 on display on the new concourse.
The email I got in reply boiled down to...it's our engine and it's staying where it is.
So I should think that any appeal would fall on deaf ears.

 

I'll certainly agree that 6229 is a beaut! I must admit I wasn't sure myself about the idea of re-streamlining her at first but... oh my... what beautiful thing she is! I do think though that some people on this forum are a bit harsh on 4472. Afterall it hasn't exactly been a sloucher. 4472 has had quite a busy career both in service and certainly in preservation. Here's most of the things that 4472 Flying Scotsman has achieved:-

- It hauled one of the world's most famous train services the prestigious non-stop Flying Scotsman train service from London to Edinburgh.
- On 30 November 1934, running a light test train, 4472 became the first steam locomotive to be officially recorded at 100 mph.
- It toured both America and Australia.
- On 8 August 1989 Flying Scotsman set another record, travelling 442 miles from Parkes to Broken Hill non-stop, the longest such run by a steam locomotive ever recorded!

So, as you can see 4472 is defintely no sloucher! No offence to fans of 6229 but while she's had quite a career and is a pretty thing, I don't think it's been quite as busy 4472... And I'm sure most of you wold agree that 4472 is quite a attractive machine aswell. Now I know 4472's overhaul has become incredibly expensive and time consuming to do but when you think of everything it has done, I think the old scot gent has justly earned it's fame and deserves a good going over... Don't you...

 

I don't think anyone is denying what 4472 has achieved, or whether 6229 is a better loco then Scotsman, just that a streamlined Coronation would capture the general publics imagination more...

 

I thought that City of Birmingham was actually in green? But moving SWIFTLY on - Hamilton, as I've said on here before, is truly magnificent; I take my hat off to Bob Meanley & his team at Tyseley, and also the NRM team for having the vision to allow this all to happen.

As Anthony has said - wait & see, but I believe that it will not be too long before we have some 'good news' about Hamilton being put back onto the main line. Let's get the 2012 'village sports' out of the way, then I suspect that many projects will 'come to life'

Here's hoping

Mark

 

I predict (come back to me if I'm wrong) that by 2014, accountants looking back at 10 years of preserved railway accounts will notice a distinct peak in revenues coinciding with the two full financial years after the televising of that "Absolutely Chuffed" film about the building of Tornado. I do believe that it put riding on steam trains into the public consciousness more than at any time since the 1980s revival of mainline running - in which by the way 4472 did have a starring role, whether you personally think this was deserved or not, before it left for Australia.

Enthusiasts love the romantic circumstances of Tornado's building, love that it has been a relatively reliable and impressive performer; they are tantalised by the thought that it could yet take 'preserved' steam to another level of speed, and not least, thanks to the A1 Trust's hiring-out policy, many have been able to observe it, rather than just see it for a few seconds, on a preserved line near to them. I think, though, that the general public have already lost their infatuation with 60163, if not their interest.

So imho, we need another high-profile, yea hyped, project like Tornado to come along every 4-5 years or so; this can only be good for preserved steam as a whole. To put it bluntly, it'll put bums on everyone's seats for a couple of years.

A P2 newbuild, looking and performing like an A4 on steroids, would do the trick. Though I'm not sure if the original design would, above all it would have to perform free of its original shortcomings.
However, that project would hardly be ready until late in this decade, while 6229 in its streamlined guise would hopefully be less of a marathon. But the Duchess would of course need a lot of money, and while there's a case for arguing that the NRM should in effect subsidise the popularity of working steam locos in general, there's an equal case for arguing that it should not.

Let's not forget, it's not too fantastical to think that 4472 could be ready before or close to any date for outshopping 6229. Let me just toss into the ring the prospect of Races to the North, with both home and away legs, to catch the public's imagination. Totally artificial of course due to the constraints of pathing, watering and speed limits, but hey, this is just a marketing issue. They manage to fix football matches, don't they?
In summary, don't underestimate what Tornado has done for the commercial side of this industry, and don't believe that the fire will burn forever without giving it a damn good stoking on a regular basis.

 

Oops!!:sorry:
I'd just been watching video of 6233.

 

I remembered this post when we were at Carlisle last week, having just arrived behind Earl of Mount Edgcumbe.

We went up onto the road bridge at the station to take some photographs, and while we were doing that, sure enough, a middle aged couple walked up to see, and the lady said "oooh, is that Flying Scotsman". We said yes :bounce:

 

Theres little doubt that Tornado has benifitted from the fact it looks like Flying Scotsman and that Flying Scotsman has been conveniently off stage whilst the other big Applegreen Machine made its debut.
Having had all the money spent that it has it will be hoped that flying scotsman is an everpresent Earner for the next twenty odd years (2 boiler tickets and timeout for overhaul) by which time attention will start to turn towards Mallards 100 Year anniversary
I think Hamiltons time will come in Conjunction with Mallards if the money and will is there and circumstances allow
Be nice to see those too parallel running somewhere would it not ?

 

I really don't think that Mallard will be running under her own steam again. She is the only A4 in this country that is anywhere near 'original' condition, besides No.7, 9 & 19 look to have a secure operating future. Although I think most people never thought Cheltenham would ever run again...

 

Funny, I've just been asked the same question "is it Flying Scotsman?" by someone seeing a video clip of Tornado. Oh well...

 

I would hope that this wasn't the case but if it we're going to cost as much as Scotsman then for the purposes of the 'Event' i imagine it would cost less to 'Dress up' one of the above... if one of the the aboves owners we're so disposed...
Perhaps part of the scotsmans 'Spare A4 Boiler' sale invoved borrowing it back for a bit ?

 

Is it just the same process that led to all vacuum cleaners being called by some "hoovers"? In ten years time an ordinary rail traveller seeing a steam special pass might say "Oooh look, it's a flying scotsman!"!

 

Let's hope not...

 

What one of these?