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The Vale of Rheidol Railway - News

Discussion in 'Narrow Gauge Railways' started by ValeOfRheidol, Nov 12, 2014.

  1. talerddig14

    talerddig14 New Member

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    Thanks for this, it's really interesting. The funny thing is Green contradicts himself about 1212, as in the loco bio he cites it languishing in the shed after 1925, as the 3 new beasts were coping. i thought Palmerston was hired to cover Rheidol, which had been damaged by a derailment rather than being a 4th engine (bar wartime, ) I have no data about returns at that time, but am guessing that the freight would have increased - Leas and sulphur could be used in ammo and zinc in gavanising, whilst timber from the Hafod estate was carried from the start (The fireman, Jack 'bach' Evans talked about 80ft trunks being carried by two bolster wagons and the loose securing chains throwing up sparks from being dragged on the rails, as they went round the top bends. fascinating stuff though
     
  2. talerddig14

    talerddig14 New Member

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    You've got to bear in mind that the land below the railway was owned by a 3rd party and it wasn't until they negotiated to cutting 12 'windows' that the views were restored.
     
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  3. 30854

    30854 Part of the furniture

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    True, though the key word is 'negotiation' and I suspect the issue wasn't really on BR(M)'s radar half a century ago. It's pleasing to note that, further north, the 'F' end of the F&WHR has benefitted from similar arrangements in recent years.

    I'd also highlight improvements at VoR stations. When I saw Aberffrwd, it was a shadow of it's former self .... a mere line of rails running through what's best described as a glade in a temperate rain forest, at a point where the ballast got noticeably wider. Had the train not paused for water, the first time visitor might've missed it entirely .... as I nearly did Capel Bangor, then reduced to a running-in board on a grassy expanse to the north of the running line. Fast forward to today and both locations really look the part. Roll on a timetable demonstrating the need to cross peak season trains at both on any given journey!

    BTW, if my observations sound unduly critical of BR, I'd like to put on record my eternal gratitude to their management and staff over the years, without whom, let's not forget, we'd have no VoR to travel and enjoy today.
     
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  4. talerddig14

    talerddig14 New Member

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    Looking through history, it seems anyone who touches the line gets caught under its spell. Oliver Veltom, Lewis Hamer etc...
     
  5. 30854

    30854 Part of the furniture

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    Not forgetting Wynford Vaughan-Thomas, whose lyrical prose on HTV, back in the day, did both the line and Cwm Rheidol proud! :)
     
  6. Goldie

    Goldie New Member

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    Here are a few photos from today's run up Cwm Rheidol - my first visit to this railway and my first chance to see the VoR's impressive locomotives up close. 1213 was in charge of the train, and seemed to have power to spare all the way up to Devil's Bridge, with a little bit of wheelspin to prove the point.

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  7. talerddig14

    talerddig14 New Member

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    1213's boiler ticket expires at month end, so it will be out for the rest of the year. The 2020 services will be run by 7 and 8, with the Garratt providing cover when it is returned to steam.
     
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  8. Dunfanaghy Road

    Dunfanaghy Road Member

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    1213 - a lovely engine (and you won't normally see me say that about GWR stuff!). Hauled me on my first visit and had a footplate ride on my visit last year.
    Pat
     
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  9. Goldie

    Goldie New Member

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    I’d never have guessed! It sounded fresh out of the works, and looked in flawless condition too. The exhaust was something else. It was like there was a massive bass speaker somewhere under the seats giving it a bit of a boost.
     
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  10. Railman3

    Railman3 New Member

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    Hello. Does anyone know what grate area is of the Swindon built VoR tanks? I have read somewhere that they are the most powerful 2ft gauge engines built for use in Britain, but I believe this claim is based only on their tractive effort. I would be interested to read a list of stats to compare with other locos. Any help would be greatly appreciated (as it will help me settle a debate with my brother!)
     
  11. meeee

    meeee Member

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    I think they are now second to David Lloyd George on paper. Even more so when it ran at 200psi.

    Of course tractive effort on paper is just one part of a big jigsaw when it comes to steam engines.

    Tim
     
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  12. PoleStar

    PoleStar New Member

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    Tractive effort 10,510 lbs. Can't find the grate area right now, but it is not usually a factor in tractive effort calculations.

    For comparison Russell which is about the same size has a grate area of 6.25 square feet.
     
  13. LesterBrown

    LesterBrown Member

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    9.04 sq. ft
     
  14. Railman3

    Railman3 New Member

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    Great (or grate). Thank you so much!
     
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  15. Railman3

    Railman3 New Member

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    Yes this was the discussion I was having with my brother! I mentioned that they were powerful, citing their tractive effort figure but he was arguing it was a poor measure of real loco power. It certainly seems they're very powerful engines compared with anything similar.
     
  16. PoleStar

    PoleStar New Member

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    Grate area is perhaps a bit misleading taken in isolation. For example a yard shunter can have a high tractive effort but a relatively small firebox, because it doesn't need to produce a lot of steam continuously.
     
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  17. MG 7305

    MG 7305 New Member

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    Comparative grate areas, 4 coupled tanks:

    Branch Line locomotive:

    48/58xx 12.8 sq ft

    Dock tank:

    1101 12.57 sq ft

    I cannot recommend the RCTS series of books enough. Fantastic reference material.

    Best regards

    Julian
     
  18. Dunfanaghy Road

    Dunfanaghy Road Member

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    Isn't that the point? The shunter needs TE as that is simply a measure of the ability to get on the move. It doesn't need a lot of HP. Take the Class 08 (known to everyone I worked with as a '350') which has 400 HP but can pull down a house, its TE is, I believe, greater than a 'King'.
    The ability to turn fuel into heat is directly related to the grate area, so that is a guide to the power output.
    Pat
     
  19. PoleStar

    PoleStar New Member

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    I think it is more correct to say that grate area is an indication of boiler power. You have to compare it with the tractive effort to get the bigger picture. The usual tractive effort formula uses only cylinder dimensions, boiler pressure and driving wheel diameter.

    In Julian's example, the 48xx and 1101 classes have practically the same grate areas, boiler pressure and cylinder dimensions, but the 1101 has smaller driving wheels which gives it a much higher tractive effort, at the expense of higher steam consumption. That is fine for heavy shunting, but it would probably run short of steam if it had to exert maximum power continuously at branch line speeds.
     
  20. 30854

    30854 Part of the furniture

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