Tornado

Apologies, have got a little mixed up and as you rightly point out, this conflab is between WCRC in its capacity as a TOC, not as a tour promoter. As you say Steam Dreams are stuck in the middle.
I would nt think it unreasonable for the Tour promoter part of the business to have favourites, especially if that favouritism is based on using reliable locos which get Bums on Seats, but having as large a variety and number of potential Locos available to use is in the interest of all parties...

 

One bit of possible bad news about WCRC unwilling to operate 60163 Tornado is she won't be able to work part of next years Great Britain rail tour if it runs next year. This could be a great shame considering you could possible have Flying Scotsman running on next years Great Britain rail tour unless DB take over the rail tour operation.

 

Latest news on the website - the paint is going on fast (hopefully not too fast!)

http://a1steam.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=747:4th-may-tender-ready-boiler-primed&catid=1:latest-news&Itemid=123

 

From the NRM website:

Upcoming moves
Monday 9 May 2011: A1 No.60163 Tornado, the first British-built UK mainline locomotive in 50 years, will be unveiled in its new Brunswick Green Livery here at the National Railway Museum. Be here at 11am to see it being shunted onto the Great Hall turntable.

http://www.nrm.org.uk/PlanaVisit/Events/locomotivemoves.aspx

 

Is she going to be carrying the earlier or later style emblem on her tender.

 

Read threads above and click link? Earlier.

 

Cheers

 

Another update, also stating there will be a test run on the 18th. http://www.a1steam.com/index.php?op...runswick-green&catid=1:latest-news&Itemid=123

 

http://www.a1steam.com/index.php?op...runswick-green&catid=1:latest-news&Itemid=123

The locomotive will be based at the NRM before visiting the North Yorkshire Moors Railway, Pickering, from Wednesday 25th May to Sunday 5th June 2011

 

Absolutely! Working for a large company which is mired in "Quality Control" and STILL can't get it right, I couldn't agree more!!

As someone else has already pointed out, the stupidity of htis particular "spat" is that the VAB and all other hurdles to main line operation have been passed, which means the loco is considered prefectly capable and safe to operate by those who count, and yet a two-bit company such as WCR who supply main line tours with some of the worst coaching stock I've ever had the misfortune to ride in can override all of this for their own reasons! Either THEY are in the wrong or their insurance company is. My sympathy is entirely with the A1 trust - they have fulfilled all the requirements for main line running and one can only wonder just what the problem is!

It's the "quality" issues which make me laugh - WRC coaches might be engineering safe, but many of them have seen better days so far as passenger comfort is concerned; they often look externally as if they haven't seen a wash in ages, carpets can be threadbare, windows rattle and leak, the list is endless - yet they see fit to disallow "TORNADO" because of an unacceptable contractor!

 

Who cares!! I certainly dont.
If west coast dont want to operate Tornado, thats up to them its their company after all.
I'm sure people on this forum wouldn't let others tell them what they should and shouldn't do with their company?
As for the V.A.B issue, at the end of the day its not the V.A.B that pays the delay bills when something goes wrong!!
Lets just leave it for all those who this actually concerns.

 

Good luck with that one!

 

"All the requirements" except perhaps that stated by your customer, that you don't use a particular unapproved contractor to do work that you want them to accept. As for "two-bit company", who are you to judge? They've delivered good results whenever I've been on their trains.

So clearly you'd rather they put "passenger comfort" before "engineering safe"? Not sure I'd agree. Both matter, but I know which they have to put first.

On this thread many people, including you, put the word quality in quotes, as if to say your definition of quality is better than that of the engineering industry's, and that it's all a load of paperpushing cobblers. I've taken my company through ISO9000 standards accreditation, and although some aspects are bureaucratic, for sure, it does provide assurance that important things are being done "to standard". If WCRC don't keep up the paintwork on their Pullmans to your desired level, or the windows rattle a bit? Well fine, don't go on them. Or do. It's not going to kill you. If WCRC didn't have standards that assure them that their trains are safe, that to me would be a much bigger problem.

They don't think a particular contractor is up to scratch, by their standards, and they told the A1 Trust that in advance, and not to use them if they wanted to do business. A1 Trust chose to ignore them. Result, A1 Trust is out on their ear. Pretty logical.

As for

well that suggests you couldn't previously either, so what's your point? Shouldn't you just leave and go work for someone who can?

 

Obviously the stock used on GB1V must belong to a different company then as they were turned out exceptionally well in my opinion, and I saw no threadbare carpets inside either.

Seems you have an axe to grind, perhaps you'd be better grinding it elsewhere as I'm fed up of people like you belittling WCRC, A1ST or RTC on here.

Dave B

 

Same from when I was on the Mayflower last year. Carriages were well turned out and although by accident we ended up paying for standard class but spent the journey in a first class seat which was accidentally given to us rather than a standard class coach.

Ooh on more exciting news isn't tomorrow when the Brunswick Green is unveiled. Not my most favourite livery but she is looking great. Depending on the time I expect that the lineside may be packed with enthusiasts between York and Scarborough on May 18th.

Shame she's going to miss out on the Scotsman party by a few days but it'll be more exciting at Barrow Hill in October with hopefully 4472, 60163, 4492 and 60532 all together.

 

Given all the thoughts expressed about the firebox repairs after Tornado's first stint in traffic, and whether or not these repairs where what might have been expected, or were more extensive, I wonder if the A1 Trust will have been given any advice from the German boiler manufacturers about heating and cooling cycles for the engine when back in traffic? ie might we see more "warm it up slowly/cool it down slowly" instructions to crews and support teams?

(Without in any way implying anything at all about how the boiler has previously been treated--I stress.)

46118

 

HI groks212 answer to your question the stock used on GB1V belongs to WCRC. thank you fish7373 81c fitter

 

ISO 9001 or any of these QMS systems do not ensure any particular finished product standard, and that is why I am wholeheartedly cynical about them. Sorry - but its King's new clothes guys - end of!

QMS records processes, not outcomes and is therefore of no use whatsoever to the end user who will still have to rely on final inspection or contract guarantee. VAB reflects final inspection of the end product so must trump ISO recording of processes.

When QMS extends itself to quality of product then it will be of real value to end users.

I have to agree as to coaching stock standards overall as I and friends have had cold and dark trips on recent railtours, which simply should not happen at £75 and more per seat. Ex works appearance such as provided every year on the GB is not the norm - I regret to say.

 

The NYMR is very pleased to announce that agreement has been reached in principle for the A1 Trust loco 60163 Tornado to visit NYMR at the end of this month. This assumes that final re-assembly is finished and all testing and certification procedures are completed in time. Hence, therefore, there is an element of uncertainty, the A1 Trust are confident that the necessary timescales will be met.

The locomotive is expected to arrive on Wednesday 25th . The provisional operating details are:


· · Thursday 26th – 175TH ANNIVERSARY DAY. 60163 to operate the following services - 10.30 GT/12.00 PG, 13.30 GT/15.00 PG) and on the W & P Anniversary Pullman (1836 GT – PG and return.) – limited ordinary seating available.

· · Saturday 28th- Wednesday 1st June (5 days) 60163 to operate the following services (SuX: 3 round trips 09.30 GT/11.00 PG, 12.30 GT/14.00 PG, 15.30 GT/17.00 PG ; SuO 10.30 GT/12.00 PG, 14.30 GT/16.00 PG)

· · Thursday 2nd – Friday 3rd June: REST DAYS – not running.

· · Saturday 4th -Sunday 5th (2 days) 60163 to operate the following services (SuX: 3 round trips 09.30 GT/11.00 PG, 12.30 GT/14.00 PG, 15.30 GT/17.00 PG ; SuO 10.30 GT/12.00 PG, 14.30 GT/16.00 PG)

· · Monday 30th Tuesday 31st – Pie and pea supper trains Grosmont to Battersby (£25 per head Adult, £12.50 Child).

Otherwise, Normal fares will apply.

To support the Tornado visit and the W & P175 Anniversary, it is also hoped to run the North Eastern Railway shuttle train on the same dates as above in the Spring Bank Holiday week (ie not Thursday 26th). This will be formed of the 2 LNER and NER coaches and hauled by NER designed Class J72 No 69023 ‘Joem’.

THESE EVENTS SHOULD SEEN AS PART OF OUR 175 ANNIVERSARY CELEBRATIONS

These will be the first passenger trains operated by 60163 in the BR Green Livery carried by the A1s for the majority of their careers. It is expected that BR Caramine and Cream Rolling Stock will be matched with the loco (as per the current tender totem) for much of the visit, with the possibility of BR Maroon stock also.

Steven

 

Excellent - An A1 as we all remember them - those of us who were there anyway - in north Eastern territory.

Well done to all!