VT - 5043 to Edinburgh - 26/27/28 May

Observation: 5043 led the train north across the Forth Bridge this morning. The consist was: 5043, class 47, carriages, class 37. This will have reversed at Inverkeithing, then travelled to Waverley via the Sub.

Interpretation: I think it is therefore very likely that the train will head south with 5043 leading and the class 47 coupled inside doing most of the work. We will see.

 

Ashame the tour has been plagued with issues like these but it can't be helped, can only hope VT consider a repeat run of the Castle to Scotland next year, if NR can come up with some better timings. Can't have good weather curse a tour for two years running could we!

Hope the passengers enjoy their day, and if the 47 is pushing, that timings and water stop are suitably adjusted to match and they may find themselves home early!

 

Just started the return trip now, if top and tail diesels isn't bad enough, now arthurs talking out his backside on the tannoy, trying to claim the 47 is in tickover/notch 1, so that why I can hear it revving up and see it clagging then, quite rightly the announcement was greeted by howls of derision in coach f.

 

I'm afraid to say that your contact is something of a fantasist. I was at Greenholme and watched 5043 start the fire in the cutting. It also started several smaller fires along the climb to Shap. In the actual spot of the main fire there were two photters, neither of whom were smoking, or carrying out any other fire-raising activites. I also didn't notice any passengers chucking fags out of the tour windows, but I suppose this can't be ruled out. What I can say with absolute certainty is that those sparks came from the tour and I'd be 99.9% sure they originated from 5043.

Given that your contact is 'very involved with the running of the tour', perhaps they'd be better to hold their hands up and admit some responsibility, rather than try to lay blame on another innocent party.

 

If this person really had been on the tour this answer would not have been at all helpful. Lets face it the tour was ruined by the timings long before the fire risk problem arose!

In these circumstances making slightly sarcastic comments to a passenger who complains would only worsen the problem. Whoever' s fault that the tour did not run as advertised it is not the paying passengers, and as their contract is with you, not WCRC or NR it is for them to pursue their claim with you and for you to obtain compensation from your suppliers.

 

I may be wrong..

but I do recall VT advertising travel insurance (or at least recommending it) for this trip at the time.

How many people ACTUALLY booked it ?

 

Laird, you have a PM.

 

Anybody know for sure if 5043 will have that box coupledright behind the tender ALL the way south today??

 

AND, I was under the impression the insurance was for acommadation rather than the trip itself.

Just pulled into abington loop again, oh joy....

Network rail have two questions to answer and it is these that I hold them responsible for:

1: why were timings so late to the extent that it was far too late for VT to rework it into something more acceptable ?.

2: The fire risk problem with bittern was known about on Tuesday, why did it take till leaving crewe on Saturday to tell us ?.

Both instances where NR was far too slow to react to what was happening and maybe spare us some of the pain.

 

people complaining about the weather should stop and consider...

In Germany..when there is a steam ban, it is nationwide total and outright due to the weather. Only 18 201 and a BR 41 is allowed to operate being oil fired.
Here in the UK, NR allows right upto the latest possible moment before declaring a diesel is required, and even then they only stipulate on which part of the journey it is needed. Had it rained on friday, you'd probably have had steam all the way, such is the restraint / flexibility shown.

Had this trip been 5043 to Berlin.. you would have been advised last week that there would have been an Electric waiting for you at the Dutch border.. all the way to Berlin and back....even if the warm weather was in the Bavarian alps and it be raining in the north throughout your journey, as your steam locomotive wouldn't have even been allowed to have a fire lit. But for sure, you wouldn't be getting any refund regardless. As here in the UK it's the trip your paying for, the locomotive or circumstance cannot be guaranteed.

In Germany Once the decision is made, it is a final decision, even if circumstance later changes to your favour.

so before blaming network rail for adding a diesel at short notice, stop and think of the alternative, as complain hard enough I am sure the german solution is easier for Network Rail to deliver.

Still I feel sorry of the passengers in the situation... I have felt it too, going to an event a few years back in Europe which turned from booked as 2x BR52s on one train and 18201 + Br35 on the other...into 2 diesel hauled trains due to fire risk..., as it happened it rained, (and despite 18201 being permitted it failed on the day)... I was out of pocket more than the cost of the 5043 to Scotland trip and no one gave me a dime back... sadly it's life and it happens, it sucks to be there, but we've all felt it at some point.

Solution: may we should have an oil fired castle ?

However against Network Rail I will say..

Had you organised the trip in Germany (and much of Europe), it would have been booked into their planning system 12 months in advance, the route and timings would not only have been organised.. but guaranteed and published at the start of the year.

 

It is usually the old growth from last year that is tinder dry - that can be the case even when it is standing in water. Spring can easily be the worst time for fire risk because you need new, green growth to come through and get properly established and we have had a number of occasions in recent years where there have been cold, dry springs that don't encourage growth. While we have had a wet spell in April, it had been pretty dry until then and we had one short spell in March that was warm but insufficient to encourage much growth before it became wet certainly, but also cold again.

The sort of area where there has been problems and which the tour needs to return through today will have plenty of tall grass which will be very dry despite the rain in April due to the strong winds there have eben recently and also the high temperatures.

 

And I'm pretty disgruntled that the whole of the UK rail network is a mess because the majority NR staff are not competent! Also if NR maintained the track-side properly many incidents (and indeed acts of vandalism) would not occur. This last comment does not just apply to steam traction.

 

Funny you should say that, I am pretty sure that was considered during the restoration, but decided against.
Perhaps someone from VT could confirm?

 

Footage from the support coach of 5043 passing 46233 at speed near Southwaite with a loud whistle from the Duchess . Steve 46233 passes 5043 on the West Coast Mainline on the 26/5/12 - YouTube

 

5043 circles the Forth 27 May 2012

On the middle day of its three day epic trip from Birmingham to Scotland, Vintage Trains provided a leisurely stroll along the banks of the River Forth with GWR Castle 4-6-0 No 5043 Earl of Mount Edgcumbe.

The lunchtime start gave time beforehand to visit the Forth Bridge, whose first crossing by a Castle would be the highlight of the tour. Then to Linlithgow where the train having overnighted at the nearby Bo'ness railway, picked up most of its passengers for the tour.

After picking up also at Dalmeny, we ventured onto the bridge itself, with the Class 47 helping to shove the ten coaches up the steep slope because of the fire risk if the Castle worked too hard. This spectacular experience was followed by a brisk canter along the coast through Fife before turning west at Thornton Junction.

The running along the north bank of the Forth was leisurely as much of it is normally freight only, and we took water at Low Torry. For our two hour break in Stirling, the train was well positioned in the glorious sunshine, and an excellent day was rounded off by a gallop back to Linlithgow, breaking the mile-a-minute barrier with a brief maximum of 66 mph.

The fire risk had cast something of a damper over the whole tour, but the punters made the most of what they could have, and were pleased to be part of another groundbreaking Vintage Trains initiative.

16 photos at Zenfolio | Peter Hewitt's Transport Pictures | 5043 circles the Forth 27 May 2012

Peter, on yet another warm and sunny afternoon in Manchester
Zenfolio | Peter Hewitt's Transport Pictures

 

Those people stood by the crossing probably couldnt believe their luck.. that is if they were waiting for either train.. if not waiting for either train they probably thought they'd seen an apparition!