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West Somerset Railway General Discussion

Discussion in 'Heritage Railways & Centres in the UK' started by gwr4090, Nov 15, 2007.

  1. Lineisclear

    Lineisclear Member

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    Following the report a considerable amount of volunteer work went into designing an implementation plan. That suggested that the re structure could be implemented quite cheaply, However it seems that the PLC board were understandably concerned about the distraction and diversion of resource that implementing a re-structure would have on the resources needed to recover from the pandemic. That's judgement call that they have the responsibility for making. I don't know enough to suggest whether they were right or wrong.
    Ultimately the immediate issue is ability to raise enough funds to create a base on which to move forward with enhanced fundraising. The benefits of charitable status in that respect are well recognised. Perhaps "Do Nothing" is an unfair criticism. It appears to be more case of focussing on re- opening the railway and raising a million pounds. I would be very surprised if the PLC board hasn't already considered all the options open to it.
     
  2. johnofwessex

    johnofwessex Resident of Nat Pres

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    Or they have factored this in to the decision and made arrangements accordingly?
     
  3. Alan Kebby

    Alan Kebby Well-Known Member

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    Perhaps they will be making payment on completion of the job, rather than paying anything up front. If so, the only risk they face is the cost of moving 1466 to a new contractor.
     
  4. Pete Thornhill

    Pete Thornhill Resident of Nat Pres Staff Member Administrator Moderator Friend

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    It’s that blindness that sums up the WSR. There are a significant amount of posters saying exactly the same thing.

    The reason of repetition is simple, nothing changes. The view I gave isn’t exclusive to Nat pres either. I can dig up numerous quotes saying the same in other places, the WSR friends group on Facebook for one, are they not representative of the wider community?

    I think that an appeal update will be very interesting, particularly how much has actually been raised so far and also against the target set so far. If it is coming up short, then you have to ask why. I think I already know the answer just from people (not just on Nat Pres) who I have spoken too and it’s hard to find someone who has donated. When asked why the exact same reasons that have come up in this thread are the reasons given. WSR can ignore that and fail or try to address the issue to get more success.

    It’s not rocket science to work out that people like to know where their donations are going, the reality is that a clear plan what the money is going to be used for inspires confidence. Instead, we have no idea, or any indication of what the railway plans to do to turn it around, that does the exact opposite.

    If you have seen Dragons Den on the TV. The successful ones have a well thought out pitch and a clear business plan. The ones who turn up just asking for money and cannot explain what they want the money for get laughed off (and rightly so), preparation and a clear plan are key. Imagine if the WSR went on there, do you think Peter Jones & co would be investing? Given what we have been presented with so far, I don’t think so…
     
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  5. Pete Thornhill

    Pete Thornhill Resident of Nat Pres Staff Member Administrator Moderator Friend

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    To be fair, the work is due to be completed by October, I don’t think the WSR will be no more by then, in the longer term however, maybe so.
     
  6. Greenway

    Greenway Part of the furniture

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    What of the support agencies such as the WSRA? Notably quiet about this matter. The only comment recently made was for Trustees, and just a small announcement, in early June, about the appeal. It does suggest some lack of support by WSR Members yet the general public are asked to cough up a million.
     
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  7. johnofwessex

    johnofwessex Resident of Nat Pres

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    I suggest several reasons, WSR itis being one, fear of being thrown off the railway being another.

    Or of course they are fully aware of what is happening & trying to work out what on earth they can do about it
     
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  8. gwilialan

    gwilialan Well-Known Member

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    JJP:- "If we do nothing and sit still the railway will bleed itself dry of money..."

    Shame he didn't realise that before while others were opening and generating revenue. Perhaps someone should have told him... Oh...
     
  9. gwilialan

    gwilialan Well-Known Member

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    Sorry to disagree but from all I've seen in the past I'd be very surprised if the PLC board has considered any options that they didn't think of. :(
     
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  10. Greenway

    Greenway Part of the furniture

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  11. Lineisclear

    Lineisclear Member

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    Perhaps unintentionally that makes an important point. Revenue alone is not necessarily a good reason for opening. If the incremental costs of operating exceed the income that can be generated then, from a purely financial perspective, re-opening with a restricted service may just make matters worse. Some heritage lines decided that there were other priorities, such as maintaining competence and volunteer morale. The assumption that the financial situation must have been better if the WSR had re opened sooner is a brave one.
     
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  12. MellishR

    MellishR Resident of Nat Pres Friend

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    I seem to recall that the PLC Board initially cited the alleged 6 figure cost as the main reason for delaying the restructuring. Then later (possibly when that huge cost was shown to be nonsense) they carried out the flawed consulation of shareholders to provide an excuse for never restructuring.
     
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  13. Sidmouth

    Sidmouth Resident of Nat Pres Staff Member Moderator

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    even in the friends facebook group someone was hoping for a visiting engine for the gala weekends . When put to them that for that to happen donations would be welcome , their response , I'm not giving any money to the WSR
     
  14. 35B

    35B Nat Pres stalwart

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    Without access to figures, it's speculation. But the fact that most railways of any scale reopened tells me something about the importance of operating, and drawing cash.

    The WSR chose not to reopen during 2020; it foresook the fares income that a reopening programme would have driven. We know that the WSR, like a number of lines, uses a mixture of volunteers and paid staff, and that there were staff furloughed. However, in those circumstances, where fixed costs remained to be met, and we know that the area had a very strong holiday season, I find it hard to believe that the net cashflow from operating would not have been positive.
     
  15. Pete Thornhill

    Pete Thornhill Resident of Nat Pres Staff Member Administrator Moderator Friend

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    Here’s a quote from the PLC Chairman, taken from the appeal press release -
    Now that clearly says money is the reason.
     
  16. martin1656

    martin1656 Nat Pres stalwart Friend

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    Unfortunately, the railway won't learn from it, because they seem unable, or unwilling to see where they have gone wrong, and anyone who points it out, gets thrown off by the PLC, It will take an " Llangollen Moment " For the truth to hit home, but it will be too late, those who created this mess won't hang around to take responsibility either, you can bet they will flee the sinking ship, the blame game will be even worse than has seen before as each group will be in full revenge mode, when its everyone's fault, going back years to not take the reduction in traffic seriously, and allowing the fabric of the line, to deteriate to the point where by it became to bad to run trains and a lot of work is needed to bring it back up to a standard where it was possible,
     
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  17. Sidmouth

    Sidmouth Resident of Nat Pres Staff Member Moderator

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    you are right , however .... many lines appreciated that summer was an opportunity and operating was something volunteers wanted to do too . Last summer there were reports that Minehead was very busy with staycationers who would quite happily I suspect filled WSR trains . I got unfriended by the chair and booted and blocked from the friends group for making this very point . I got the impression the attitude was we'll just pull the duvet up, bury our heads under it , go lalalalalalala and all of this will go away .

    Many will remember the positive coverage many got on mainstream media as they reopened , appearing on local TV and press . The WSR gifted us a redundancy consultation on the platform at Minehead and an appeal video focusing on the pigeons and tumbleweeds on the platform . its almost as if they want it to go under ...
     
    Last edited: Jul 6, 2021
  18. jnc

    jnc Well-Known Member

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    Too bad the WSR has put off the organizational re-arrangement, so that significant assets are owned by a separate trust, making them immune if the trading company goes bust; that might relieve the concerns of some potential donors. (Yes, if the trading company is operating at a loss, there's still an issue; but if e.g. the track, and the maintenance thereof, etc were moved to a separate entity, that should make running the trading company 'in the black' easier.)

    PS:
    Sound like the WSR has got itself into a 'chicken and egg' situation. People won't donate the money needed to save the line to the current structure, but they can't/won't change the structure.

    Noel
     
    Last edited: Jul 6, 2021
  19. Bayard

    Bayard Well-Known Member

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    I think you are confusing "number of posters" with "percentage of posters". However, it's not just that most of the people who habitually post on here have made this point, it is also noticeable that there are a high proportion of posters who appear to be coming onto this thread to point out the lack of clarity of the appeal's objectives who don't normally post on this thread and that we are not "just seeing the same hands in the air".
     
  20. Bayard

    Bayard Well-Known Member

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    OTOH, wasn't it already the case then that the Seaward Way crossing equipment had come to the end of its useful life, so the Minehead staycationers couldn't have caught a train from Minehead anyway?
     

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