WHR General Discussion.

Re: WHR, has it a future?

This is supposed to be THE year for the WHR and here you all are squabling about numbers of passengers etc. Wait and see what happens, as i have already said the WHR is too flash, with no soul, park and ride stations, big buisness etc. One day it's going to finish up being owned and operated by the state, with modern traction and we will be all wondering what went wrong.This is what you get when an operation is conducted by people with their heads in the sand. I live in Europe and i have been to practically all the NG preservation and industrial sites throughout Europe right up to the Russian border, i have wrote articles for many different railway magazines in different countries and am presently participating on the new tramway being constructed in Brest, France, i have seen what works and what does not. At present i believe the WHR has no future unless it gets it's act together right now, climb down from its' high horse and makes up with the WHR 1964, maybe even a complete change of management would be a good idea. As far as i'm concerned give me the new Corris anyday !!! One last word for the WHR--- Please get rid of those Garratts.

 

Re: WHR, has it a future?

Well i believe im right untill prooved otherwise, then of course there is free speech and lastly im not expecting everyone to agree with me. If you like Garratts thats fine by me, but in my opinion there going to be ONE of the reasons why the WHR in its present form won't work.

 

Re: WHR, has it a future?

the charm of the welsh narrow guage in the first place was its quaintness and near dereliction.... the WHR does rather fly in the face of this and it seems foolish for it to ignore the heritage in favour of the scenery.

 

Re: WHR, has it a future?

The WHR is not a railway to visit for its quaintness ! Its a lengthy line operating through rugged country and needs a rugged loco to power its trains - and there's nowt as rugged as a Garrat.

Despite renovator's "I know what works" critique I can assure him that the Garrats do NOT seem out of place on this line and I for one am both happy to see them at work and make the effort to undergo a 3-hour drive just to spend a day with them. I think many commentators are being a shade presumptive; let the line be fully opened and have time to settle into a comfortable routine then consider its efficacy.

After all its no use complaining about the taste of the tea when the kettle has yet to boil.

 

Re: WHR, has it a future?

the hereitgae side could be catered for quite easily if they accomodated the 1964 company.....

 

Re: WHR, has it a future?

no it isnt any NOW but could have been and maybe could still regain an element of it.

 

Re: WHR, has it a future?

Recreating the old WHR would NOT work now for the same reasons it didnt work in the past, and would directly compete with the FR as a 'historical' railway. While it would be nice to see occasional heritage trains, if you follow the railway you'll be well aware that just for practical and financial reasons that isnt going to happen for some time yet, regardless of the politics for which both sides are just as guilty...

In my eyes the WHR is the equivalent of the Llanberis Lake and Snowdon Moutain Railway's - the scenery and location gets the passengers on the train and the experience, while not historically accurate, is attractive and comfortable to the general public and to the line's many supporters and volunteers. This is not a 'heritage railway', and if you dont like huge powerful locos slogging up gradients with heavy trains then it wont be your cup of tea, but the only constraint to the line's success is its ability to keep up with the considerable demand!


Chris

 

Re: WHR, has it a future?

Well it's good to see that there are those who see things the way i do. I must say to Fred Kerr that i didn't say ' i know what work`s` but in fact 'ive seen what works`, there is a big difference there. Competition with the WHR 1964, why not ? i'd even go to say, go for it !! May the best man win. I think from certain remarks made, it's all about big bucks and numbers, thats partly why i don't like the Garratts, it's because they symbolise exactly that mentality. For the rest, I.E creating an railway with a real character, close to the public, recreating an atmosphere belonging to it's own heritage, this has all gone out the window for the sake of one thing, money.

 

Re: WHR, has it a future?

Given that the railway has been built on the cheap with second hand clapped out locos, limited facilities for both staff and passengers, low quality second hand track materials on the early phases and no real signaling, your statement doesn't really make much sense. Especially if you consider there is little or no money to finish the job at the moment.

If anyone on the FR has any sense the extra profits made this year will be used to pay off some of the hefty overdraft and hire some much need maintenance staff.

I'd imagine the atmosphere of the original WHR was rather awful, a decrepit loco pulling a short train of empty rotting carriages very slowly to nowhere in particular. Doesn't sound like a tourist attraction to me.

Tim

 

Re: WHR, has it a future?

No. Its gone out of the window for the sake of one thing, an attempt to make the WHR profitable!

Its not like there was much to preserve of the old railway anyway, and what there was (the building at Waunfawr, and... err...?)is likely to be rebuilt in the future anyway. I cant help but feel that the people who bemoan the WHR not being 'heritage' enough have very little knowledge of the WHR's actual history and if they did they would feel no inclination to see it recreated! There's a very good reason the two historical coaches on the current trains see little use when there's room in the modern ones, and its not because they are locked by the guard... ;-)

Chris

 

Re: WHR, has it a future?

Very few heritage railways are true heritage railways, with stock being used on them being completely historically inaccurate, I know, I wrote an essay on it at University (which anyone can have a copy on if they want!?)

The fact of the matter is that the WHR has done what its done to offer a tangable example of a heritage railway whilst maintaining an effective transport corridor and being financially viable. I might prefer Russell to the NGG16s, but I accept that it is completely unviable to try and 'preserve' the WHR any better then it has been done, and I think those involved should be commended for doing as well as they have!

People need to get real and move on, be glad that there are steam trains running at all!

 

Re: WHR, has it a future?

How can you possibly say that it is unviable to try and preserve the WHR any better than it has been done ? Do you really mean that ? of course you can do better, for example, we could have an high speed electric tramway derived units running at ten minute intervalles, with a full service in the winter, a comprehensive school service, cheap fares, air conditioning, free on-board internet, all that plus sliding doors !!. Come on now, with all the money and time chucked on this project we should of ended up with something better than that. There's a whole lot of people completely missing the point, certain values have been forgotten.

 

Re: WHR, has it a future?

Yes maybe i was being ironic, but it does sound good though !!. As for what can be done, let's wait a bit. There's going to be the North Wales Light rail Transit coming !!

 

Re: WHR, has it a future?

Exactly. The WHR has had very little time to consolidate and while its very rudimentary facilites are very much like the WHR of old, its going to take the next 5-10 years to get all the carriages, buildings, sheds and locos (NG15's as well as Garratts) that the line needs. Then we'll see the line's potential fully realised.

Chris

 

Re: WHR, has it a future?

Ok, but by that time all the customers will have come and gone, never to return again. Lastly, if you want to see Snowdon, you take the SMR.

 

Re: WHR, has it a future?

If you want to see Snowdon you wouldn't take the SMR, as the best place to see it in all it's glory is from the first class compartment of a restored bowsider going accross the cob behind Merddin Emrys.

If the WHR ends up makeing millions, then perhaps we can invest some of that money in restoring more slate waggons, it's the pointless projects that make a railway.